Mentors: Climate Change is Hopeless? Here’s Why You Should Still Fight

1
00:00:00,146 --> 00:00:02,546
What do you do when your role
models in science tell you it's

2
00:00:02,546 --> 00:00:04,290
too late to fix climate change?

3
00:00:04,290 --> 00:00:08,100
Today, I wanna speak directly to
the young scientists who listen to

4
00:00:08,100 --> 00:00:12,299
this podcast, who refuse to give
up even when the people they're

5
00:00:12,299 --> 00:00:14,853
supposed to look up to already have.

6
00:00:14,943 --> 00:00:17,013
We're gonna talk about that
on today's episode of the How

7
00:00:17,013 --> 00:00:18,213
to Protect the Ocean Podcast.

8
00:00:18,453 --> 00:00:19,443
Let's start the show.

9
00:00:22,488 --> 00:00:22,938
Hey everybody.

10
00:00:22,938 --> 00:00:25,818
Welcome back to another exciting episode
of the How to Protect the Ocean Podcast.

11
00:00:25,818 --> 00:00:28,278
I'm your host, Andrew Lewin, and this
is the podcast where you find out what's

12
00:00:28,278 --> 00:00:31,128
happening with the ocean, how you can
speak up for the ocean, what you can do to

13
00:00:31,128 --> 00:00:34,128
live for a better ocean by taking action.

14
00:00:34,308 --> 00:00:37,308
On today's episode, I'm gonna be
speaking right directly to young

15
00:00:37,308 --> 00:00:40,158
scientists who want to do something
about climate change, especially

16
00:00:40,158 --> 00:00:42,048
within the ocean conservation world.

17
00:00:42,168 --> 00:00:45,108
Whether you're a scientist, even
if you're an ocean conservationist

18
00:00:45,108 --> 00:00:46,428
and you're new to this.

19
00:00:46,603 --> 00:00:52,123
I want you guys to feel everyone to
feel, Hey, I could do something, and I

20
00:00:52,123 --> 00:00:55,453
don't want you to let people talk you
out of it, but I'm gonna give you some

21
00:00:55,453 --> 00:01:00,803
context on why they may be speaking to
you and saying, Hey, by the way, this,

22
00:01:00,803 --> 00:01:02,573
what you're trying to do may not work.

23
00:01:02,573 --> 00:01:03,983
So I don't want you to feel down.

24
00:01:03,983 --> 00:01:06,323
I want to give you a little bit of
context of why they're feeling that

25
00:01:06,323 --> 00:01:09,983
way, from someone who's mid-career
and already starting to get jaded

26
00:01:09,983 --> 00:01:11,783
like this ocean conservation field.

27
00:01:11,993 --> 00:01:14,783
And I want you to just understand that.

28
00:01:14,863 --> 00:01:17,143
But first what I want to do is
kind of talk you about how I

29
00:01:17,143 --> 00:01:18,793
got inspired to do this episode.

30
00:01:19,003 --> 00:01:22,473
I received an email from a young
scientist, a young lady who kind

31
00:01:22,473 --> 00:01:26,193
of just told me what she was being
frustrated in, and it was her mentors

32
00:01:26,193 --> 00:01:27,933
were telling her, Hey, you know what?

33
00:01:27,933 --> 00:01:31,503
We appreciate how gung-ho you are to
try and do something about climate,

34
00:01:31,503 --> 00:01:32,883
but it's really not gonna work.

35
00:01:33,235 --> 00:01:36,355
kind of feel both sides to this 'cause
I've been that young scientist who felt

36
00:01:36,355 --> 00:01:38,245
that way and who got told the same thing.

37
00:01:38,245 --> 00:01:40,975
And I feel like all young
scientists get told that.

38
00:01:41,305 --> 00:01:46,171
But I'm also almost at the age where I'm
like, I understand where some of these

39
00:01:46,171 --> 00:01:49,788
older scientists that are mentors who are
just like, Hey, I wanna look out for you.

40
00:01:49,868 --> 00:01:52,238
What you think you're
gonna do may not work out.

41
00:01:52,268 --> 00:01:53,918
'cause it's very easy to get jaded.

42
00:01:53,918 --> 00:01:55,508
It's very easy to get frustrated.

43
00:01:55,601 --> 00:01:58,511
And if you talk to anybody who's
been in science for a long time,

44
00:01:58,511 --> 00:02:00,851
you're gonna see that they're
more skeptical than anything else.

45
00:02:01,061 --> 00:02:05,266
Because as what happens is when you first
start in ocean conservation, whether

46
00:02:05,321 --> 00:02:08,831
you're a scientist, whether you're ocean
conservationist or anything like that, you

47
00:02:08,921 --> 00:02:10,991
are bright-eyed and bushy-tailed, right?

48
00:02:10,991 --> 00:02:11,771
You're ready to go.

49
00:02:11,771 --> 00:02:12,671
You're ready to do this.

50
00:02:12,671 --> 00:02:16,181
You've been spoken to by scientists,
maybe the very same scientists that

51
00:02:16,181 --> 00:02:19,871
you now work and look up to at some
point in your life when you were in

52
00:02:19,871 --> 00:02:22,811
elementary school or middle school
or high school, or even university.

53
00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:26,790
And you have been spoken to by some
of the people there who have been

54
00:02:26,790 --> 00:02:29,430
providing environmental education
saying, Hey, you're the difference.

55
00:02:29,430 --> 00:02:30,270
You're the future.

56
00:02:30,450 --> 00:02:31,140
It's up to you.

57
00:02:31,140 --> 00:02:32,490
We kind of screwed up the planet.

58
00:02:32,700 --> 00:02:33,570
It's up to you.

59
00:02:33,690 --> 00:02:36,570
And then you grow into that, and then
all of a sudden you do university

60
00:02:36,570 --> 00:02:37,710
and you start to talk to professors.

61
00:02:37,710 --> 00:02:40,256
You look at what's in front of
you and what all the different

62
00:02:40,256 --> 00:02:43,016
possibilities and different ways you
can go through science or conservation

63
00:02:43,016 --> 00:02:44,156
or wherever you decide to go.

64
00:02:44,186 --> 00:02:45,626
And you're like, Hey, I can do this.

65
00:02:45,626 --> 00:02:46,466
Like, this is really great.

66
00:02:46,466 --> 00:02:47,331
I'm getting very excited.

67
00:02:47,331 --> 00:02:48,651
And you get into the real world.

68
00:02:48,873 --> 00:02:52,803
You're outta science and you might be into
graduate work or even just as a research

69
00:02:52,803 --> 00:02:54,933
scientist or you know, entry level field.

70
00:02:55,003 --> 00:02:57,763
You're starting to work with some of your
mentors and you're starting to interact

71
00:02:57,763 --> 00:02:59,473
with them at conferences and so forth.

72
00:02:59,563 --> 00:03:01,213
And you're like, yeah, I
can't wait to get into this.

73
00:03:01,213 --> 00:03:02,023
I can't wait to do this.

74
00:03:02,023 --> 00:03:02,833
I can't wait to do that.

75
00:03:02,923 --> 00:03:05,503
And then you realize they're
saying, well, hold on a second.

76
00:03:05,563 --> 00:03:07,213
Do you think you can
actually change something?

77
00:03:07,503 --> 00:03:09,363
We've been doing this for 30, 40 years.

78
00:03:09,363 --> 00:03:10,683
Do you think you can actually do this?

79
00:03:10,723 --> 00:03:12,703
It crushes your heart.

80
00:03:12,823 --> 00:03:15,643
It just crushes it,
and it makes you angry.

81
00:03:15,643 --> 00:03:16,423
It made me angry.

82
00:03:16,423 --> 00:03:16,993
That's how I feel.

83
00:03:16,993 --> 00:03:19,573
I am not speaking for the person
who emailed me, but I'm like,

84
00:03:19,573 --> 00:03:21,703
it made me angry to be like.

85
00:03:22,243 --> 00:03:22,873
What do you mean?

86
00:03:22,873 --> 00:03:23,743
I can't do anything?

87
00:03:23,743 --> 00:03:24,733
Like this is why I got in.

88
00:03:24,823 --> 00:03:28,453
Everybody kept telling me like, it is up
to me to do this and that's why I'm here

89
00:03:28,453 --> 00:03:30,313
and I'm gonna be part of the solution.

90
00:03:30,313 --> 00:03:31,603
I'm not gonna be part of the problem.

91
00:03:31,873 --> 00:03:34,963
And I wanna support scientists and
I've done that as much as I can

92
00:03:34,963 --> 00:03:40,303
throughout my career, is to try and
not dissuade other scientists and

93
00:03:40,303 --> 00:03:42,403
conservationists from doing things.

94
00:03:42,456 --> 00:03:47,736
And I think there's a lot of emotional
weight when people get disillusioned

95
00:03:47,736 --> 00:03:52,791
by mentors or frustrated at the silence
around the responsibility, but also.

96
00:03:53,180 --> 00:03:54,800
There's still that determination to fight.

97
00:03:54,990 --> 00:03:57,950
And you're not sure if, like, do you
not listen to your mentors and do

98
00:03:57,950 --> 00:04:00,769
it anyway or is that a good thing
or a bad thing for your career?

99
00:04:00,769 --> 00:04:03,860
Do you just put your head down and do
your science and whatever that might be?

100
00:04:03,860 --> 00:04:06,649
That might be, if it does
something, amazing, that's great.

101
00:04:06,649 --> 00:04:06,890
If not.

102
00:04:07,141 --> 00:04:08,161
Like, that's okay.

103
00:04:08,298 --> 00:04:11,508
And that's hard because a lot of young
scientists are kind of told, like from

104
00:04:11,508 --> 00:04:15,708
a political standpoint, which a lot of
the problems that we face in terms of

105
00:04:15,708 --> 00:04:17,718
trying to change things are political.

106
00:04:17,718 --> 00:04:20,328
When we're talking about climate
change, there's things that need to

107
00:04:20,328 --> 00:04:25,338
happen at a legislative scale, whether
it be federal state, or regional or

108
00:04:25,338 --> 00:04:27,988
like county or municipal governments,
depending on where you live,

109
00:04:27,988 --> 00:04:28,858
that needs to happen.

110
00:04:28,951 --> 00:04:33,841
And unfortunately, the people who are
elected to those positions oftentimes

111
00:04:33,841 --> 00:04:37,231
are not ready for the commitment to
fight climate change, either they're

112
00:04:37,231 --> 00:04:40,331
against climate change, but they want
to take it from a realistic point of

113
00:04:40,331 --> 00:04:42,131
view, and so they're not fully there.

114
00:04:42,599 --> 00:04:47,549
And that's been frustrating not only for
you, but also for scientists for decades.

115
00:04:47,819 --> 00:04:51,269
And I want to give you a bit of
context of what these scientists have

116
00:04:51,269 --> 00:04:55,539
gone through that are now maybe in a
position to be mentors or to be people

117
00:04:55,539 --> 00:04:59,019
that you know, you look up to, or that
everybody looks up to, including myself.

118
00:04:59,153 --> 00:05:02,453
What's happened is, you know, now
we're at a point where we're seeing

119
00:05:02,453 --> 00:05:06,023
in climate change, we're seeing the
consequences that were predicted

120
00:05:06,023 --> 00:05:08,013
10, 20, 30, 40, 50 years ago.

121
00:05:08,678 --> 00:05:08,964
Right.

122
00:05:08,964 --> 00:05:11,694
And nobody believes scientists,
we're seeing it now.

123
00:05:11,694 --> 00:05:13,584
We're seeing the wildfires,
we're seeing the droughts.

124
00:05:13,584 --> 00:05:16,284
We're seeing the increased
hurricanes, typhoons, cyclones.

125
00:05:16,344 --> 00:05:19,494
We're seeing the increase in storm
surge increase in everything.

126
00:05:19,594 --> 00:05:22,714
We're seeing bad things happen to
good people and innocent people,

127
00:05:22,714 --> 00:05:24,004
and it's gutting to see it.

128
00:05:24,004 --> 00:05:27,289
And the amount of money spent on
cleaning up those disasters is awful.

129
00:05:27,671 --> 00:05:31,211
And so what we're fighting now is we're
like, we need to fight now more than ever.

130
00:05:31,496 --> 00:05:32,606
Every scientist knows that.

131
00:05:32,606 --> 00:05:34,076
Every conservationist knows that.

132
00:05:34,076 --> 00:05:37,346
But it's the realism about doing it,
especially when you have governments

133
00:05:37,346 --> 00:05:40,826
of, you know, like you do in the states,
even in Canada, where both governments

134
00:05:40,826 --> 00:05:44,396
are trying to figure out economically
what's happening with their countries.

135
00:05:44,666 --> 00:05:48,266
And like for Canada, we're actually
impacted by the decisions made in the

136
00:05:48,266 --> 00:05:52,766
US And so we have to make decisions
that will be more about the economy

137
00:05:52,766 --> 00:05:53,876
than it is about the environment.

138
00:05:53,876 --> 00:05:55,483
Unfortunately, I've
talked about this before.

139
00:05:55,566 --> 00:05:56,826
Those decisions aren't made together.

140
00:05:56,826 --> 00:05:58,746
Those decisions are made
against one another.

141
00:05:58,746 --> 00:06:02,106
So if we're making changes for the
economy, trying to stabilize our economy,

142
00:06:02,106 --> 00:06:05,136
because we're a natural resource country,
we tend to go against the environment.

143
00:06:05,226 --> 00:06:06,486
And so that's obviously a problem.

144
00:06:06,516 --> 00:06:07,686
and so we're trying to change that.

145
00:06:07,686 --> 00:06:08,046
Now.

146
00:06:08,046 --> 00:06:10,026
We're like, why aren't we doing this now?

147
00:06:10,026 --> 00:06:14,166
It's the same words that scientists that
are now the mentors and people you look

148
00:06:14,166 --> 00:06:17,106
up to used 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 years ago.

149
00:06:17,196 --> 00:06:17,436
Right.

150
00:06:17,436 --> 00:06:21,046
And their mentors did the same thing,
but the problem was is back even

151
00:06:21,046 --> 00:06:23,956
20 years ago, and we still see it
today, but it's really hard to do.

152
00:06:24,276 --> 00:06:24,801
There was denial.

153
00:06:25,296 --> 00:06:28,746
When I grew up in the nineties and early
two thousands in my like university

154
00:06:28,746 --> 00:06:32,030
career, when I learned about climate
change and I learned all the intricacies

155
00:06:32,030 --> 00:06:35,510
of science and how it's affecting like the
ocean and how it's affecting freshwater

156
00:06:35,510 --> 00:06:36,589
and land and everything like that.

157
00:06:36,589 --> 00:06:39,979
And what is gonna happen in 20
years which was rightly predicted,

158
00:06:39,979 --> 00:06:41,599
people were just denying it.

159
00:06:41,599 --> 00:06:42,379
Oh, that's not true.

160
00:06:42,439 --> 00:06:43,819
These scientists are making it up.

161
00:06:43,819 --> 00:06:44,869
I don't know why they're doing it.

162
00:06:44,869 --> 00:06:45,859
They just want funding.

163
00:06:45,859 --> 00:06:47,569
It's all this BS and blah, blah, blah.

164
00:06:47,569 --> 00:06:49,519
We've heard it for 20 years, 30 years.

165
00:06:49,659 --> 00:06:53,701
And we know now that it was fossil fuel
companies that were sort of feeding that

166
00:06:53,701 --> 00:06:57,451
misinformation through campaigns and
like intricate campaigns and complex

167
00:06:57,451 --> 00:07:00,991
campaigns because they're the same bodies
that lobby the government and that pay

168
00:07:00,991 --> 00:07:04,711
for people to get into government that
support their campaigns to get into

169
00:07:04,711 --> 00:07:07,736
government so that they can make sure
that their business is gonna do well.

170
00:07:08,175 --> 00:07:11,835
And so what you have to realize that all
these companies that have been messing

171
00:07:11,835 --> 00:07:15,164
around with science, that have messing
around with scientists, really, you

172
00:07:15,164 --> 00:07:20,984
know, fueling the misinformation, age
has jaded the scientists for a long time.

173
00:07:21,224 --> 00:07:23,264
They've been attacking
scientists online, they've been

174
00:07:23,264 --> 00:07:24,404
attacking scientists otherwise.

175
00:07:24,869 --> 00:07:28,049
Other ways they've been taking
over, like funding for quote unquote

176
00:07:28,049 --> 00:07:30,269
biodiversity projects and all this stuff.

177
00:07:30,269 --> 00:07:33,359
It's been really like BS and
they're doing it for greed.

178
00:07:33,409 --> 00:07:37,039
So in the email that was sent to me,
this audience member, you know, found

179
00:07:37,039 --> 00:07:40,819
my podcast through this show that I
entitled Climate Change and Capitalism,

180
00:07:40,869 --> 00:07:44,739
where I talked about how the greed of
capitalism has really been the driver for

181
00:07:44,739 --> 00:07:48,669
companies taking over, the government,
taking over legislation and so forth

182
00:07:48,669 --> 00:07:52,329
in such ways where they get legislation
put in place to protect their business.

183
00:07:52,549 --> 00:07:56,298
You can look at any government
right now that is really propelling.

184
00:07:56,686 --> 00:08:00,803
Oil and gas over renewables, and
you will see that there's a fossil

185
00:08:00,803 --> 00:08:02,243
fuel industry that's doing that.

186
00:08:02,319 --> 00:08:03,579
Even with plastic pollution.

187
00:08:03,579 --> 00:08:06,729
We see fossil fuels industries
involved overfishing.

188
00:08:06,729 --> 00:08:10,659
We see greed in terms of companies
that are just trying to get as

189
00:08:10,659 --> 00:08:13,539
many fish as possible and sell
them off as quickly as possible.

190
00:08:13,539 --> 00:08:14,889
They don't care about the legalities.

191
00:08:14,889 --> 00:08:16,269
They're gonna go to the high seas.

192
00:08:16,319 --> 00:08:17,639
And it's been a very difficult process.

193
00:08:17,639 --> 00:08:20,969
It's not artisanal fishers that are
contributing to the overfishing.

194
00:08:21,269 --> 00:08:25,979
It is the massive companies that you're
very hard to track that, you know, have

195
00:08:26,029 --> 00:08:31,069
fishing slaves and all this bias that
happens on the high seas and elsewhere

196
00:08:31,069 --> 00:08:34,219
where they are getting away literally
with murder and they're taking all

197
00:08:34,219 --> 00:08:35,269
the fish while they do it as well.

198
00:08:35,269 --> 00:08:37,099
So it's all greed that is happening here.

199
00:08:37,099 --> 00:08:39,859
And scientists have, you know,
their job is to take science.

200
00:08:39,859 --> 00:08:43,176
I've talked about this before, where
it's like scientists are like the first

201
00:08:43,226 --> 00:08:46,406
sort of line of figuring out trends,
whether they're positive or negative.

202
00:08:46,406 --> 00:08:49,376
If they find a negative trend, then
they try and take that trend and they

203
00:08:49,376 --> 00:08:53,006
go, Hey, you know, to the government
or to whoever they publish it in a peer

204
00:08:53,006 --> 00:08:56,506
reviewed literature paper that nobody has
access to 'cause they're super expensive

205
00:08:56,506 --> 00:09:00,256
to get because these companies who have
these journal articles just want money.

206
00:09:00,256 --> 00:09:03,016
They don't really care about
the actual information that gets

207
00:09:03,016 --> 00:09:04,096
out there for the most part.

208
00:09:04,096 --> 00:09:06,706
And they want tens of thousands
of hundreds of thousands of

209
00:09:06,706 --> 00:09:08,866
dollars from universities that
will pay for those subscriptions.

210
00:09:08,866 --> 00:09:12,466
But people like you and I, unless they're
open access, we don't get access to those.

211
00:09:12,646 --> 00:09:13,756
So we don't have access to those.

212
00:09:13,756 --> 00:09:16,326
So what happens is these organizations,
like the NGOs and so forth.

213
00:09:16,581 --> 00:09:19,641
Forth, we'll get access to those or
researchers will reach out to them

214
00:09:19,641 --> 00:09:22,541
because they have partnerships and they
network and they get there and they get

215
00:09:22,541 --> 00:09:25,001
that information and all of a sudden
that information comes to them and

216
00:09:25,001 --> 00:09:28,511
they're like, okay, like we have the
information and we can spread it out.

217
00:09:28,511 --> 00:09:29,501
And that's how it works.

218
00:09:29,501 --> 00:09:30,491
We spread it out.

219
00:09:30,886 --> 00:09:33,946
And it goes all over the place so
that people, individuals, and other

220
00:09:33,946 --> 00:09:36,616
organizations, all that kinda stuff,
they make reports and stuff and then

221
00:09:36,616 --> 00:09:39,196
they go to the policy and they go
to the policy people and they say,

222
00:09:39,196 --> 00:09:40,156
well, this is what we need to change.

223
00:09:40,156 --> 00:09:40,966
This is why.

224
00:09:41,146 --> 00:09:43,306
And they lobby the government and
they put pressure on the government to

225
00:09:43,306 --> 00:09:46,156
be like, Hey, we need to get, change
this because we are having trouble.

226
00:09:46,156 --> 00:09:49,726
And then what happens is you see those
politicians who are backed by companies

227
00:09:49,726 --> 00:09:52,786
and corporations and so forth, look at it
and be like, wow, this is actually against

228
00:09:52,786 --> 00:09:56,506
what we're about as a party or as a
government and we need to look at this

229
00:09:56,506 --> 00:09:59,776
more carefully, and then they try and hide
it and they don't vote on it and so forth.

230
00:09:59,776 --> 00:10:01,276
And so some of them do
and some of them don't.

231
00:10:01,276 --> 00:10:01,996
It all depends.

232
00:10:02,059 --> 00:10:05,749
Or some will do the easy way and
will go into, protected areas where

233
00:10:05,749 --> 00:10:09,499
there's nothing to worry about and for
them, and they usually do it in around

234
00:10:09,499 --> 00:10:11,329
indigenous lands and so forth, and not

235
00:10:11,329 --> 00:10:15,619
around areas that are in the continental
US or in Canada and so forth, that

236
00:10:15,619 --> 00:10:18,889
is more difficult to protect because
there are more stakeholders involved.

237
00:10:18,946 --> 00:10:22,666
That's a short way of saying from a long
story of how sort of conservation works

238
00:10:22,666 --> 00:10:24,226
and the frustrating part of conservation.

239
00:10:24,406 --> 00:10:25,906
Every generation goes through it.

240
00:10:25,906 --> 00:10:29,356
We all go through our young generation
where we like, Hey, we're ready to go.

241
00:10:29,356 --> 00:10:30,226
We just graduated.

242
00:10:30,226 --> 00:10:30,856
We're ready to go.

243
00:10:30,856 --> 00:10:32,116
We're bright-eyed, bushy-tailed.

244
00:10:32,116 --> 00:10:34,546
We wanna fight against climate
change and we wanna reduce

245
00:10:34,546 --> 00:10:35,451
climate change and so forth.

246
00:10:35,633 --> 00:10:37,463
Then we get to a point
mid-career, we're like, oh,

247
00:10:37,463 --> 00:10:39,203
we've seen a lot of battles lost.

248
00:10:39,483 --> 00:10:41,073
We're getting a little more jaded.

249
00:10:41,283 --> 00:10:44,043
We're seeing more of the realistic
point of view of how things are going,

250
00:10:44,043 --> 00:10:45,873
and they're not changing that quickly.

251
00:10:46,053 --> 00:10:48,543
And we're starting to see
some of these things happen.

252
00:10:48,753 --> 00:10:51,933
Some of these disasters happen more
and more and more, and then we get

253
00:10:51,933 --> 00:10:54,573
to a point now where it's like, we're
seeing it usually every year and

254
00:10:54,573 --> 00:10:55,803
there's always something going on.

255
00:10:55,803 --> 00:10:58,923
There's always something bad happening
from a nature perspective, and it's

256
00:10:58,923 --> 00:11:01,573
climate change and everything pulled
back to climate change, and we're still

257
00:11:01,573 --> 00:11:05,003
seeing governments not to fight against
climate change or like go completely

258
00:11:05,003 --> 00:11:08,483
opposite and deny it and say it's not
really that big of a deal, or go in front

259
00:11:08,483 --> 00:11:10,043
of the UN and do all that kind of stuff.

260
00:11:10,043 --> 00:11:12,833
And so people get more and more
frustrated and we just sit there and

261
00:11:12,833 --> 00:11:15,623
there are scientists who are sitting
there and they're right in a way is.

262
00:11:15,623 --> 00:11:18,323
We are in climate change, we
are almost past the tipping

263
00:11:18,323 --> 00:11:19,793
point where we can't go back.

264
00:11:19,793 --> 00:11:23,093
And there are governments who are
still in power, whether they wanna

265
00:11:23,093 --> 00:11:25,943
make changes or not, who are still
not making changes fast enough

266
00:11:25,943 --> 00:11:27,203
because we're seeing it more and more.

267
00:11:27,203 --> 00:11:29,483
We're seeing the changes more
and more where we can't go back.

268
00:11:29,483 --> 00:11:31,553
A lot of them are saying,
Hey, you know what?

269
00:11:31,743 --> 00:11:33,663
We're gonna have to get used
to this and we're gonna have

270
00:11:33,663 --> 00:11:35,283
to go more into adaptation.

271
00:11:35,433 --> 00:11:38,013
And to be honest, that's what a lot of the
fossil fuel companies want you to think,

272
00:11:38,013 --> 00:11:39,363
that there's nothing you can do about it.

273
00:11:39,543 --> 00:11:42,333
So let's just keep doing fossil fuels
like we've been doing it before.

274
00:11:42,543 --> 00:11:43,803
Obviously that's not right.

275
00:11:43,863 --> 00:11:46,933
And there are governments, and every
government is usually have mostly

276
00:11:46,933 --> 00:11:50,893
investing in renewable energy, but it's
taking a long time to put them together.

277
00:11:51,103 --> 00:11:54,513
Takes a long time for it to come to
fruition and come to into production.

278
00:11:54,513 --> 00:11:57,453
And so we're trying to figure that
out, but we're not moving fast enough.

279
00:11:57,684 --> 00:12:03,204
So here is my, I guess advice of
what you can do, and obviously this

280
00:12:03,204 --> 00:12:07,074
is not exhaustive, but this is what
I would say is the best thing to do.

281
00:12:07,074 --> 00:12:11,064
So join or create a climate
forward scientist collective.

282
00:12:11,064 --> 00:12:13,434
Now, there are some places
out there already for Ocean.

283
00:12:13,434 --> 00:12:17,059
I'm part of a group it's a WhatsApp
group that future swells a part of, and

284
00:12:17,059 --> 00:12:21,406
we do little things here and there to
try and put together petitions and put

285
00:12:21,406 --> 00:12:24,826
together, you know, science communication
pieces and stuff to get out there.

286
00:12:24,826 --> 00:12:25,456
and they do that.

287
00:12:25,456 --> 00:12:26,356
Their future swells.

288
00:12:26,356 --> 00:12:27,679
The organization that controls it.

289
00:12:27,756 --> 00:12:30,336
They tend to put these ideas together
and they bring the people together.

290
00:12:30,336 --> 00:12:31,986
And we try and all put all that together.

291
00:12:32,116 --> 00:12:34,726
You can also join things like
union of Concern scientists,

292
00:12:34,726 --> 00:12:36,976
scientists rebellion, ocean uprise.

293
00:12:37,136 --> 00:12:39,506
Those are always, always great as well.

294
00:12:39,654 --> 00:12:42,114
There's also, think it's
Clean Creatives, I think it's

295
00:12:42,114 --> 00:12:45,644
called, which is like a science
communication creative place, online.

296
00:12:45,644 --> 00:12:48,891
It's a Slack group that I've been a
part of, and that's been great as well.

297
00:12:48,974 --> 00:12:51,051
So join or start one of your own.

298
00:12:51,271 --> 00:12:51,686
Those are always great.

299
00:12:52,281 --> 00:12:54,651
Start science communication
projects on your own.

300
00:12:54,651 --> 00:12:58,971
So figure out what your network
needs to know and put those together.

301
00:12:58,971 --> 00:13:02,241
You know, write, speak, post
podcasts, do a video, whatever

302
00:13:02,241 --> 00:13:03,831
it takes to get the message out.

303
00:13:03,831 --> 00:13:04,221
Do it.

304
00:13:04,381 --> 00:13:08,611
Even if you do it on your own, it'll
start to really grow your knowledge

305
00:13:08,641 --> 00:13:10,861
on what it works and what doesn't.

306
00:13:11,071 --> 00:13:13,921
And then it'll get your voices
out because there are people who

307
00:13:13,921 --> 00:13:16,556
may listen to this podcast, but
may prefer your voice better.

308
00:13:16,993 --> 00:13:19,873
and there are other people who don't
listen to this podcast and may want

309
00:13:19,873 --> 00:13:22,213
your message better 'cause they
might just connect with you better.

310
00:13:22,423 --> 00:13:26,016
So the more we have the diverse
voices speaking, the better it is.

311
00:13:26,016 --> 00:13:27,006
And it doesn't mean like.

312
00:13:27,081 --> 00:13:30,291
People who look like me or sound
like me and come from the same

313
00:13:30,291 --> 00:13:31,491
background can't speak out too.

314
00:13:31,491 --> 00:13:34,071
Everybody needs to speak out and
more people need to speak out.

315
00:13:34,178 --> 00:13:37,178
And you can also build or contribute
to interdisciplinary networks.

316
00:13:37,178 --> 00:13:40,778
So mental health, social justice,
indigenous knowledge, climate policy.

317
00:13:40,881 --> 00:13:42,561
All those solutions need all of that.

318
00:13:42,561 --> 00:13:43,551
So that's always great.

319
00:13:43,551 --> 00:13:46,251
You can create open source
or citizen science projects.

320
00:13:46,251 --> 00:13:50,781
So share research outside of paywalls,
which is always great, co-create data with

321
00:13:50,781 --> 00:13:52,791
communities affected by climate change.

322
00:13:52,971 --> 00:13:53,841
That's the big thing.

323
00:13:53,841 --> 00:13:56,511
And then of course, seek mentors
outside of traditional institutions.

324
00:13:56,561 --> 00:13:58,931
Look for activists, look for
independent research, look for

325
00:13:58,931 --> 00:14:00,371
journalists, look for community leaders.

326
00:14:00,371 --> 00:14:03,701
I look for people on TikTok and
Instagram who are actively speaking

327
00:14:03,701 --> 00:14:05,381
out to things that they prefer.

328
00:14:05,381 --> 00:14:08,651
These are the things that you
know you would need to do.

329
00:14:08,921 --> 00:14:13,301
Now, what I want you to do as I end this,
is I want you to realize that yes, you are

330
00:14:13,301 --> 00:14:17,081
going to hear voices in your life, whether
you look up to them or not, who are

331
00:14:17,081 --> 00:14:18,791
going to criticize what you want to do.

332
00:14:18,791 --> 00:14:20,021
They're gonna say that it doesn't work.

333
00:14:20,021 --> 00:14:22,001
They're gonna say that,
Hey, this isn't for you.

334
00:14:22,001 --> 00:14:22,806
This is not what you need.

335
00:14:23,068 --> 00:14:27,141
You don't necessarily have to ignore them,
listen to them, but also do what you want

336
00:14:27,141 --> 00:14:31,214
to do because it doesn't mean that if
they failed or theirs didn't work out,

337
00:14:31,214 --> 00:14:32,804
it doesn't mean yours can't work out.

338
00:14:32,804 --> 00:14:34,754
We're at a very different
time than when they grew up.

339
00:14:34,844 --> 00:14:37,994
Even when I grew up, you know where
information can be shared and information

340
00:14:37,994 --> 00:14:39,764
can be passed around a lot easier.

341
00:14:40,784 --> 00:14:44,024
It's still a lot of misinformation out
there, but if you can put together in

342
00:14:44,024 --> 00:14:48,464
your own voice, be authentic to yourself
and put it out there, that will help.

343
00:14:48,854 --> 00:14:51,584
The other thing I'm gonna say
is there's nothing wrong with

344
00:14:51,584 --> 00:14:53,714
working a job to protect yourself.

345
00:14:53,714 --> 00:14:56,624
Like work your job to pay your
bills, to enjoy what you want

346
00:14:56,624 --> 00:14:58,454
to do, get your like goals out.

347
00:14:58,574 --> 00:15:01,784
It doesn't necessarily have to
align with what you want to do

348
00:15:01,784 --> 00:15:03,074
from a climate change perspective.

349
00:15:03,074 --> 00:15:06,434
You can always do that outside of your job
if that's what you're passionate about.

350
00:15:06,434 --> 00:15:06,794
Right?

351
00:15:06,854 --> 00:15:10,424
Now obviously it's ideal to find a job
where you can do both, and I suggest you

352
00:15:10,424 --> 00:15:15,243
do that, but a lot of the times, science
in itself does not mean political stuff

353
00:15:15,243 --> 00:15:18,753
or does not mean something where you may
show a bias towards doing climate change.

354
00:15:18,839 --> 00:15:23,339
Science in itself has to be unbiased and
you have to test a specific hypothesis.

355
00:15:23,339 --> 00:15:26,639
Now, testing hypothesis can mean
anywhere in science from actually

356
00:15:26,639 --> 00:15:29,609
look going out into the environment
and sampling or looking at how people

357
00:15:29,609 --> 00:15:32,909
react to behavior change that will
lead more towards climate change.

358
00:15:32,909 --> 00:15:33,899
Do you see what I mean here?

359
00:15:34,079 --> 00:15:37,953
So these are the different ways that
you can go into look at the breadth of

360
00:15:37,953 --> 00:15:39,783
ocean conservation and ocean science.

361
00:15:39,783 --> 00:15:43,443
Don't just look at how do mammals
travel or how do mammals breathe,

362
00:15:43,443 --> 00:15:44,793
or physiology and stuff like that.

363
00:15:44,793 --> 00:15:47,583
If you're really looking into
climate action is how can you take

364
00:15:47,583 --> 00:15:50,463
something like a marine mammal
and make that into climate action?

365
00:15:50,926 --> 00:15:54,376
How do you take a topic that you like
and make it into climate action from

366
00:15:54,376 --> 00:15:56,146
a science particular point of view?

367
00:15:56,253 --> 00:15:59,913
So I think that's where we need
to really sit there and understand

368
00:15:59,913 --> 00:16:03,603
that this is where you need to
move, but definitely move on it.

369
00:16:03,933 --> 00:16:07,473
Do what you need to do to
get your passion out there.

370
00:16:07,503 --> 00:16:09,789
Be passionate, be authentic to yourself.

371
00:16:09,789 --> 00:16:13,509
Use your own voice, but
definitely take action.

372
00:16:13,704 --> 00:16:14,964
You may need to adapt.

373
00:16:14,994 --> 00:16:18,204
It may not work what you want to
do, and so listen to what people

374
00:16:18,204 --> 00:16:21,294
have done to see what's worked for
them and what may not work for you.

375
00:16:21,294 --> 00:16:24,654
You can always try it and repeat it
and see if it works for you, but also

376
00:16:24,654 --> 00:16:28,134
adapt to what they've done and see how
you can get around the hurdles that

377
00:16:28,134 --> 00:16:30,594
they faced and stand on their shoulders

378
00:16:30,594 --> 00:16:33,444
to be able to build on what they
couldn't go further in doing.

379
00:16:33,564 --> 00:16:35,664
You know, that's what
science all is, right?

380
00:16:35,664 --> 00:16:38,214
When we take science and we try
and build on the knowledge that

381
00:16:38,214 --> 00:16:41,634
one research paper gives, we try
and build it on the next, right?

382
00:16:41,634 --> 00:16:44,334
And we try and build more
information on that topic, and

383
00:16:44,334 --> 00:16:45,774
that's how we understand that topic.

384
00:16:45,774 --> 00:16:49,284
So understanding how we can do climate
action, how people can do it, whether

385
00:16:49,284 --> 00:16:52,584
it's from a behavioral change standpoint
or how do we get policy in there?

386
00:16:52,584 --> 00:16:56,484
Or even how people elect, or even from
a scientific standpoint in the ocean,

387
00:16:56,665 --> 00:16:59,905
how do we get people to understand
what's going on is the biggest thing.

388
00:16:59,905 --> 00:17:01,254
So do what you need to do.

389
00:17:01,254 --> 00:17:05,185
Obviously I'm more communication focused,
but do what you think you need to do.

390
00:17:05,185 --> 00:17:07,105
Use that wonderful mind of yours.

391
00:17:07,285 --> 00:17:10,855
Use that passion of yours and
say, I am going to change things.

392
00:17:10,855 --> 00:17:14,125
I'm not gonna let anybody talk me out of
it, but I'm gonna listen to them because

393
00:17:14,125 --> 00:17:18,505
they come with experience and they come
with challenges, and they may or may not

394
00:17:18,505 --> 00:17:21,655
have been able to overcome all of their
challenges, but I'm gonna listen to them.

395
00:17:21,655 --> 00:17:23,935
I'm gonna say, okay, I'm gonna
stand on your shoulders and I'm

396
00:17:23,935 --> 00:17:26,875
gonna build upon them, but I'm
not gonna take your negativity to

397
00:17:26,875 --> 00:17:28,345
say, I'm not gonna do anything.

398
00:17:28,345 --> 00:17:30,250
I'm just gonna put my head down
and do what I'm supposed to do.

399
00:17:30,500 --> 00:17:31,280
We need change.

400
00:17:31,310 --> 00:17:32,149
We need rebels.

401
00:17:32,149 --> 00:17:35,120
We need people who are gonna say,
no, I'm not gonna take the status quo

402
00:17:35,120 --> 00:17:36,199
and I'm gonna continue to do that.

403
00:17:36,199 --> 00:17:38,120
That's why I'm doing this
podcast, to be honest.

404
00:17:38,216 --> 00:17:39,296
So that's what it is.

405
00:17:39,296 --> 00:17:41,551
And you may not see change right
away, and you have to be patient.

406
00:17:42,028 --> 00:17:44,398
But I say go for it and I
hope this message helps.

407
00:17:44,398 --> 00:17:45,748
So, that's it for today's episode.

408
00:17:45,748 --> 00:17:47,758
If you have any more questions
or comments, you know how to get

409
00:17:47,758 --> 00:17:50,548
ahold of me, you can email me again
for the person who emailed me.

410
00:17:50,698 --> 00:17:53,338
I didn't wanna mention your name 'cause I
didn't ask beforehand if I could do this.

411
00:17:53,338 --> 00:17:56,488
But once I read the email, I
was inspired to record this

412
00:17:56,488 --> 00:17:58,018
episode because of that person.

413
00:17:58,018 --> 00:17:59,818
So I really appreciate you emailing me.

414
00:17:59,848 --> 00:18:00,998
I will email you back.

415
00:18:01,111 --> 00:18:01,471
That's it.

416
00:18:01,471 --> 00:18:03,931
If you wanna also get ahold
of me on Instagram, dm me

417
00:18:03,931 --> 00:18:05,341
at how to protect the ocean.

418
00:18:05,521 --> 00:18:08,701
But we need to change and we need to
do things that will help us change.

419
00:18:08,701 --> 00:18:11,578
So, learn, adapt, act, learn, adapt, act.

420
00:18:11,578 --> 00:18:12,718
Continue to do that.

421
00:18:12,798 --> 00:18:13,818
That's it for this episode.

422
00:18:13,818 --> 00:18:16,038
I wanna thank you so much for
joining me on today's episode of the

423
00:18:16,038 --> 00:18:17,298
How to Protect the Ocean Podcast.

424
00:18:17,478 --> 00:18:19,848
I'm your host, Andrew Lewin from
the True North Strong and Free.

425
00:18:20,028 --> 00:18:20,628
Have a great day.

426
00:18:20,628 --> 00:18:22,548
We'll talk to you next time
and happy conservation.