April 1, 2026
You Have the Skills, So Why Is Nobody Hiring You?
You got the degree. You built some skills. Maybe you even started networking. So why does getting that first real job in ocean conservation still feel nearly impossible?
In this episode of How to Protect the Ocean, I break down the real reason so many early career ocean professionals get stuck. I talk about the experience trap, how to rethink what counts as experience, why small projects matter more than people realize, and how strategic volunteering can either help your career or waste your time. I also share how reputation, reliability, and offering value first can open doors that job boards never will.
If you are trying to break into marine biology, ocean conservation, science communication, fisheries, research, policy, or any ocean-related field, this episode will help you stop waiting for the perfect opportunity and start building one.
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Transcript
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You've got the degree,
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maybe even have the skills.
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So why can't you get that first real job?
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You've applied, you've networked a bit,
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you've done what people told you to do.
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So why does it feel like
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you're stuck outside the door?
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This is the How to Protect the Ocean
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podcast, your weekly
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ocean news and career insight
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podcast.
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If you care about building a career that
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actually protects the
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ocean, hit that follow button
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so you don't miss this week's episode.
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Mondays and Tuesdays was all about
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building careers, whether you're
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networking or building
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your own skillset yourself.
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And then the rest of the week, we're
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going to be talking about
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ocean career builder stuff.
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So don't forget to hit that follow button
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so you don't miss any of these episodes.
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All right, let's talk about the
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experience trap, the most
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frustrating part of this whole
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process.
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You need experience to get a job, but you
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need a job to get
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experience is the conundrum,
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the chicken or the egg, right?
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And in ocean conservation, this problem
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is worse than in a
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lot of other industries.
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Why?
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Because funding is limited.
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Like teams are small and organizations
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don't have the time
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to train from scratch.
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So when they hire, they look for people
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who can contribute immediately.
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That's not unfair, but
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it's, it creates a bottleneck.
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And that bottleneck is
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where most people get stuck.
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So here's the shift you need to make.
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Experience is not just paid work.
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Let me say that again.
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Experience is not just paid work.
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It includes volunteering, internships,
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side projects, content
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creation, research you do
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on your own.
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We talked a lot about
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this in yesterday's episode.
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And this is where a
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lot of people mess up.
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They wait for someone to give them
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experience, but the people
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who break into those first
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jobs, they build it.
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Examples, you analyze open ocean data and
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you post your findings online.
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You start a blog
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explaining Marine issues.
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You help a small NGO with social media.
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You create a GIS map
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and share it publicly.
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That's experience.
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And more importantly, it's visible.
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If no one is opening the door, you have
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to build your own door.
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This is where most people hesitate.
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They think I don't want to bother people.
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I don't want to ask for too much, but
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that's the wrong mindset.
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You're not asking for a job.
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You're offering value for people.
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You can say, for example, Hey, I saw your
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project on color
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restoration and I put together
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short summary, a map or
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content piece that might help.
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Would you like me to share it?
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Now you're not a stranger.
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You're someone useful and
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useful people get remembered.
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You know, here's a here's a quick story
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about someone who
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unfortunately recently passed
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away.
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Billy Causey.
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I, uh, I, when I was younger, I was
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working for a private
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consulting firm and I want to
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do like a side project.
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I want to build a GIS
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database and I contacted him.
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I want to contact him and I sent him an
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email and I didn't get anything back.
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But then when I contacted him again, I
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actually called them.
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This is the days when you can get phone
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numbers and I called them
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and he answered the phone
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and I said, Hey, Mr.
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Causey, my name is Andrew Lewin.
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I am a young, you know,
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marine scientist in Canada.
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I've used to do work
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in the Gulf of Mexico.
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I understand you work for the marine
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sanctuary and I wanted to
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help you organize a database
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for the marine
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sanctuary, like a GIS database.
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And he was like, wow,
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that's really great.
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He started talking to me.
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He's like, Hey,
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Andrew, can I call you back?
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I'm about to take off on a flight.
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We're in, I'm on the plane and they're
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telling me to get off the phone.
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Can I call you back when I land?
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And I was like, yeah, sure.
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No problem.
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Thank you.
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And so like, I didn't
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think anything of it.
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I, to be honest, I didn't think he'd call
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back as soon as he
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lands, he called back and
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he was like sketching
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out stuff in on the plane.
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Now, am I saying that you
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have to call somebody up?
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No, you probably don't do that.
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This these days and you may not even get
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their phone number and
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they may not even answer
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these days.
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But the thing is, is Billy did answer and
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we worked for years
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together trying to put
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pieces together, you know, and, and I
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think that's just what
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it's like to work in this.
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And when you offer some value now, you
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know, that's a lot of free work.
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I took on a big project and you know, I
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helped out wherever I
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can, but I'm not saying you
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have to take on this big project, but do
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what you want to do to
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get the experience that
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you need.
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And that's what I was doing.
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I was getting the experience that I need.
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Now let's talk about volunteering because
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it could go very, very wrong.
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Volunteering is
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powerful if it's strategic.
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It's not an endless line of free labor.
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Ask yourself, am I
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learning something valuable?
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Am I building something that I can show?
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And am I connecting
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with people in the field?
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If the answer is no, you need
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to rethink that opportunity.
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Also, you should think about
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there's a time to walk away.
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If you're not growing, not getting
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exposure or not moving
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forward, staying there could
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cost you.
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This is where things start to compound.
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One small opportunity leads to another.
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If you use it properly, this is what I
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call reputation stacking.
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So you show up on time, you deliver what
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you promised and you communicate clearly.
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And suddenly you're the person people can
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trust and trust is
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everything in this field,
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because when someone hears, hey, we need
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help on this project,
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they don't go to job boards.
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They go to people they already know.
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And here's like a quick story again.
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I do a podcast with Dr. David
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Ebert and I called beyond jaws.
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And we talk a lot about careers and Dave
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is one guy like, you
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know, he's old school, right?
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He's been in the business for a long
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time, but he constantly tells people as
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he's as he's mentored
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graduate students for a very, very long
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time throughout his career,
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he constantly tells people.
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He's like, Hey, look, like if I have a
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graduate student that I'm
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working with, and they're really,
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really good.
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I'm out there almost shopping them around
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to PhD programs or to
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people they know he knows
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in the business.
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He's got a lot of contacts within, you
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know, within NOAA or
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academic institutes or private
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consulting firms, because he's had a lot
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of students and, you
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know, all of his colleagues,
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they will say, Hey, I've got a student
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here who's really, really good.
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They're looking to do a postdoc or PhD or
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something like that.
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Would you like to take them on as a
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student because they're perfect for what
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you want to work on?
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When you when you show what you can do,
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whether you're doing it as a student,
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whether you're doing
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it as volunteering, people will back you
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up. Your reputation will
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proceed you and that will help you
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get opportunities. They may be paying
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jobs, it may be volunteer,
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there may be student jobs,
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or there might be a graduate opportunity,
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but those will pay
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forward for you for the work
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that you're doing. And, you know, there's
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there's a thing that we
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we've seen about volunteering
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around, you know, around the ocean and,
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you know, in the world.
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And there's this sort of
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predatory type of volunteering where
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organizations are using
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people who can pay money
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to go and get experience, whether it's
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two weeks, a month,
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two months, three months,
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and that's fine if you have the money to
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in the means to do so. But
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not everybody can do that.
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Most people can't do that. And I feel
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like it's predatory because
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you're not always getting what
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you need. You're paying a lot of money
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for getting something
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little, but unfortunately,
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the people who get the experience will
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get opportunities to get
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jobs after because they
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have experience because they've shown
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they can work on a project, they can show
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they can work in team
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environment, and that's their
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volunteering. They're just
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paying to get it done. So they're
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guaranteed to get it done. So you have to
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be careful with some of
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those. I find some are using
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them for using people who have degrees as
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their profession. You just
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have to be careful. Some are
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really great. Some are not. But make sure
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you look up references of
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other people who have done
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the program. If they enjoyed it, make
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sure you you see like reviews online,
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make sure the people
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that have been through the program got
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what they wanted out of it. If they
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didn't, it's not well
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organized. Just be careful. Also, safety,
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safety matters in a big
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way. So if you feel stuck right
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now, you're not alone. Just know that.
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But the next mistake is
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thinking that the next step is
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the perfect job. It's never going to be.
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It's not. It's the next step
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is this next small opportunity.
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You know, one project, one collaboration,
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one piece of work you can
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point to. And that's how people
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break in to their first real job, quote
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unquote, real job. So stop
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waiting for that perfect job.
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Create one small opportunity this week
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and turn into something
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bigger. And if you know someone
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trying to break into ocean conservation,
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send them this episode.
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Make sure that they are part
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of the community and that people know
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what they can do to break in
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to get that first real job.
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I want to thank you so much for joining
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me on today's episode of the How to
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Protect the Ocean podcast.
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I'm your host, Andrew. And if you have a
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comment or a question,
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please feel free if you're really
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listening to this on Spotify, you can put
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a comment in. But otherwise, go to
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speakupforblue.com
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forward slash feedback.
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Let me answer your question if you have a
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question or a comment. I'd love to see
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00:08:36,750 --> 00:08:39,000
it. Speakupforblue.com forward slash
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forward slash forward slash
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feedback. Sorry, I had trouble doing
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that. But I want to thank you again for
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joining me. Have a great day. We'll talk
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to you next time and happy conservation.
00:00:00,458 --> 00:00:01,250
You've got the degree,
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maybe even have the skills.
3
00:00:03,875 --> 00:00:06,500
So why can't you get that first real job?
4
00:00:07,583 --> 00:00:09,250
You've applied, you've networked a bit,
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00:00:09,833 --> 00:00:11,291
you've done what people told you to do.
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00:00:11,666 --> 00:00:13,083
So why does it feel like
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00:00:13,083 --> 00:00:15,375
you're stuck outside the door?
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00:00:16,208 --> 00:00:17,208
This is the How to Protect the Ocean
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00:00:17,208 --> 00:00:18,166
podcast, your weekly
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00:00:18,166 --> 00:00:19,750
ocean news and career insight
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00:00:19,833 --> 00:00:20,208
podcast.
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00:00:20,541 --> 00:00:22,000
If you care about building a career that
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00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:23,041
actually protects the
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00:00:23,041 --> 00:00:24,458
ocean, hit that follow button
15
00:00:24,458 --> 00:00:26,375
so you don't miss this week's episode.
16
00:00:26,416 --> 00:00:27,750
Mondays and Tuesdays was all about
17
00:00:27,750 --> 00:00:29,541
building careers, whether you're
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00:00:29,541 --> 00:00:30,958
networking or building
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00:00:30,958 --> 00:00:32,500
your own skillset yourself.
20
00:00:33,250 --> 00:00:34,625
And then the rest of the week, we're
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00:00:34,625 --> 00:00:35,916
going to be talking about
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00:00:35,916 --> 00:00:37,250
ocean career builder stuff.
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So don't forget to hit that follow button
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00:00:39,458 --> 00:00:41,500
so you don't miss any of these episodes.
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00:00:42,416 --> 00:00:43,125
All right, let's talk about the
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experience trap, the most
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frustrating part of this whole
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process.
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You need experience to get a job, but you
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need a job to get
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experience is the conundrum,
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the chicken or the egg, right?
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And in ocean conservation, this problem
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is worse than in a
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lot of other industries.
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Why?
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Because funding is limited.
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Like teams are small and organizations
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don't have the time
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to train from scratch.
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So when they hire, they look for people
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who can contribute immediately.
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That's not unfair, but
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it's, it creates a bottleneck.
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And that bottleneck is
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where most people get stuck.
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So here's the shift you need to make.
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Experience is not just paid work.
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Let me say that again.
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Experience is not just paid work.
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It includes volunteering, internships,
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side projects, content
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creation, research you do
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on your own.
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We talked a lot about
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this in yesterday's episode.
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And this is where a
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lot of people mess up.
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They wait for someone to give them
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experience, but the people
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who break into those first
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jobs, they build it.
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Examples, you analyze open ocean data and
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you post your findings online.
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You start a blog
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explaining Marine issues.
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You help a small NGO with social media.
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You create a GIS map
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and share it publicly.
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That's experience.
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And more importantly, it's visible.
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If no one is opening the door, you have
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to build your own door.
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This is where most people hesitate.
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They think I don't want to bother people.
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I don't want to ask for too much, but
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that's the wrong mindset.
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You're not asking for a job.
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You're offering value for people.
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You can say, for example, Hey, I saw your
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project on color
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restoration and I put together
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short summary, a map or
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content piece that might help.
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Would you like me to share it?
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Now you're not a stranger.
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You're someone useful and
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useful people get remembered.
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You know, here's a here's a quick story
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about someone who
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unfortunately recently passed
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away.
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Billy Causey.
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I, uh, I, when I was younger, I was
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working for a private
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consulting firm and I want to
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do like a side project.
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I want to build a GIS
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database and I contacted him.
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I want to contact him and I sent him an
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email and I didn't get anything back.
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But then when I contacted him again, I
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actually called them.
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This is the days when you can get phone
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numbers and I called them
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and he answered the phone
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and I said, Hey, Mr.
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Causey, my name is Andrew Lewin.
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I am a young, you know,
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marine scientist in Canada.
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I've used to do work
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in the Gulf of Mexico.
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I understand you work for the marine
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sanctuary and I wanted to
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help you organize a database
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for the marine
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sanctuary, like a GIS database.
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And he was like, wow,
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that's really great.
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He started talking to me.
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He's like, Hey,
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Andrew, can I call you back?
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I'm about to take off on a flight.
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We're in, I'm on the plane and they're
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telling me to get off the phone.
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Can I call you back when I land?
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And I was like, yeah, sure.
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No problem.
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Thank you.
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And so like, I didn't
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think anything of it.
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I, to be honest, I didn't think he'd call
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back as soon as he
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lands, he called back and
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he was like sketching
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out stuff in on the plane.
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Now, am I saying that you
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have to call somebody up?
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No, you probably don't do that.
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This these days and you may not even get
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their phone number and
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they may not even answer
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these days.
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But the thing is, is Billy did answer and
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we worked for years
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together trying to put
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pieces together, you know, and, and I
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think that's just what
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it's like to work in this.
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And when you offer some value now, you
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know, that's a lot of free work.
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I took on a big project and you know, I
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helped out wherever I
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can, but I'm not saying you
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have to take on this big project, but do
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what you want to do to
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get the experience that
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you need.
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And that's what I was doing.
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I was getting the experience that I need.
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Now let's talk about volunteering because
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it could go very, very wrong.
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Volunteering is
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powerful if it's strategic.
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It's not an endless line of free labor.
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Ask yourself, am I
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learning something valuable?
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Am I building something that I can show?
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And am I connecting
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with people in the field?
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If the answer is no, you need
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to rethink that opportunity.
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Also, you should think about
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there's a time to walk away.
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If you're not growing, not getting
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exposure or not moving
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forward, staying there could
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cost you.
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This is where things start to compound.
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One small opportunity leads to another.
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If you use it properly, this is what I
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call reputation stacking.
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So you show up on time, you deliver what
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you promised and you communicate clearly.
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And suddenly you're the person people can
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trust and trust is
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everything in this field,
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because when someone hears, hey, we need
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help on this project,
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they don't go to job boards.
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00:05:07,625 --> 00:05:09,041
They go to people they already know.
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00:05:09,583 --> 00:05:11,416
And here's like a quick story again.
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I do a podcast with Dr. David
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00:05:13,583 --> 00:05:15,625
Ebert and I called beyond jaws.
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00:05:15,625 --> 00:05:17,666
And we talk a lot about careers and Dave
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00:05:17,666 --> 00:05:19,458
is one guy like, you
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00:05:19,458 --> 00:05:20,625
know, he's old school, right?
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He's been in the business for a long
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time, but he constantly tells people as
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he's as he's mentored
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graduate students for a very, very long
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time throughout his career,
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he constantly tells people.
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He's like, Hey, look, like if I have a
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graduate student that I'm
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working with, and they're really,
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really good.
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00:05:35,833 --> 00:05:38,625
I'm out there almost shopping them around
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to PhD programs or to
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people they know he knows
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in the business.
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00:05:43,041 --> 00:05:45,666
He's got a lot of contacts within, you
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00:05:45,666 --> 00:05:46,541
know, within NOAA or
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00:05:46,541 --> 00:05:49,416
academic institutes or private
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00:05:49,416 --> 00:05:50,625
consulting firms, because he's had a lot
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00:05:50,625 --> 00:05:51,666
of students and, you
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00:05:51,666 --> 00:05:53,958
know, all of his colleagues,
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00:05:54,208 --> 00:05:55,875
they will say, Hey, I've got a student
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00:05:55,875 --> 00:05:56,916
here who's really, really good.
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00:05:56,916 --> 00:05:58,583
They're looking to do a postdoc or PhD or
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00:05:58,583 --> 00:05:59,166
something like that.
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00:05:59,833 --> 00:06:01,583
Would you like to take them on as a
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00:06:01,583 --> 00:06:03,000
student because they're perfect for what
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00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:03,833
you want to work on?
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When you when you show what you can do,
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whether you're doing it as a student,
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whether you're doing
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it as volunteering, people will back you
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up. Your reputation will
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proceed you and that will help you
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get opportunities. They may be paying
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jobs, it may be volunteer,
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there may be student jobs,
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or there might be a graduate opportunity,
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but those will pay
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forward for you for the work
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that you're doing. And, you know, there's
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there's a thing that we
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we've seen about volunteering
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around, you know, around the ocean and,
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you know, in the world.
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And there's this sort of
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predatory type of volunteering where
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organizations are using
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people who can pay money
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to go and get experience, whether it's
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two weeks, a month,
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two months, three months,
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and that's fine if you have the money to
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in the means to do so. But
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not everybody can do that.
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Most people can't do that. And I feel
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like it's predatory because
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you're not always getting what
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you need. You're paying a lot of money
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for getting something
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little, but unfortunately,
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the people who get the experience will
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get opportunities to get
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jobs after because they
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have experience because they've shown
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they can work on a project, they can show
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they can work in team
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environment, and that's their
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volunteering. They're just
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paying to get it done. So they're
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guaranteed to get it done. So you have to
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be careful with some of
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those. I find some are using
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them for using people who have degrees as
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their profession. You just
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have to be careful. Some are
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really great. Some are not. But make sure
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you look up references of
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other people who have done
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the program. If they enjoyed it, make
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sure you you see like reviews online,
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make sure the people
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that have been through the program got
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what they wanted out of it. If they
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didn't, it's not well
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organized. Just be careful. Also, safety,
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safety matters in a big
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way. So if you feel stuck right
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now, you're not alone. Just know that.
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But the next mistake is
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thinking that the next step is
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the perfect job. It's never going to be.
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It's not. It's the next step
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is this next small opportunity.
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You know, one project, one collaboration,
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one piece of work you can
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point to. And that's how people
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break in to their first real job, quote
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unquote, real job. So stop
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waiting for that perfect job.
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Create one small opportunity this week
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and turn into something
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bigger. And if you know someone
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trying to break into ocean conservation,
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send them this episode.
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Make sure that they are part
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of the community and that people know
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what they can do to break in
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to get that first real job.
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I want to thank you so much for joining
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me on today's episode of the How to
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Protect the Ocean podcast.
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I'm your host, Andrew. And if you have a
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comment or a question,
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please feel free if you're really
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listening to this on Spotify, you can put
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a comment in. But otherwise, go to
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speakupforblue.com
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forward slash feedback.
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Let me answer your question if you have a
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question or a comment. I'd love to see
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it. Speakupforblue.com forward slash
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forward slash forward slash
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feedback. Sorry, I had trouble doing
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that. But I want to thank you again for
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joining me. Have a great day. We'll talk
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to you next time and happy conservation.
