You Left a Public Comment. Now What?

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this week you've been following a process
for the California Marine Protected Areas

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Network that we've been covering all on
the episode from Monday to today's
episode.

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And we've been talking about a lot of
different things.

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And, you know, one of the calls to action
that I've been asking is for people to,

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you know, put in their public comment for
the meetings or show up to the meetings.

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But what happens after the meetings?

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Like how do you know what the outcomes
are?

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And how do you make sure you can follow
all the rules?

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I think that's the big thing. Cause what
happens like the coverage stops

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and you're left with the most like
practical question of all.

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Like, does anything actually change for
you?

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Does anything actually change for me?

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How would I even find out? And to be
honest,

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we're gonna provide that honest plan
answer with a couple of question

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and answers that we're gonna go through on
today's episode of the How

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to Protect the Ocean podcast. because this
is what this podcast is for.

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I want to make sure that you can get the
decision that you can get

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the answers that you deserve when you
follow this type of process.

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Cause there's one thing about for me and
others to ask you to participate within

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a specific process, a public comment
period,

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show up to a public meeting, but you got
to know the answers,

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right? That's the big question.

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That's the big thing with all this.

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You're doing it for change. How do you
know what happens with the change

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and how do you follow the change and make
sure the change is implemented?

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You're following the rules.

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All that kind of stuff. We're gonna talk
about that on today's episode of

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the How to Protect the Ocean podcast.

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I'm your host, Andrew Lewin. I'm marine
biologist,

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a science communicator, the ocean
communications manager for

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a consulting firm called Pisces Oceans,

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where we help ocean projects succeed so
they can have a positive impact

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on the ocean. and we love doing that.

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And this is what I love doing.

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I love talking about ocean stuff,

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but this I'm very excited about this
episode

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because this is where you and I are gonna
go through and try to get

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rid of that uncertainty of when things are
asked of you and you don't really know

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the answer. Because sometimes,

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an organization will ask you to do
something.

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they may not communicate to you whether
things have changed or not,

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or you're not on their email list,

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so you don't get the updates, or you know,

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maybe you're not hooked into their social
media and you don't get the updates.

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There's a lot of uncertainty that goes on
and they've asked you to do a lot,

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or they'll ask you to take

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Time out of your day to do something for
the ocean.

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So you want to make sure that you find
what actually happened.

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So I'm going help you through that process
by answering a few questions,

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the first thing to answer is like,

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how would I know what's actually allowed
at a specific marine protected area?

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there are 124 marine protected areas in
the network in California.

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So just to give you how you can find that
information.

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The California Department of Fish and
Wildlife maintains

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the authoritative current maps and
regulations for every MPA in the state

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on its own MPA programs. Pages will link
to that in the show notes.

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And it matters because like the news
coverage of a decision stops after,

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once they tell the listener. And so you
can go to this site and you can

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go on this to make sure that you can see
the actual line-by-line rule

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for the specific spot that you care about.

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The state's own regulation pages are the
only source that's guaranteed current once

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a rule change formally takes shape.

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Now, that doesn't necessarily mean it's
gonna go up fast,

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That doesn't necessarily mean that's gonna
happen,

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but it's gonna happen at some point,

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and you'll be able to check that.

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And people would can update you on that,

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or if you just check it on a regular
basis,

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you can always do that. To be honest,

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you can have something like AI to give you
a formal,

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like check the website every day and give
you an update once that that's been

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updated.

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All right, let's go to question two.

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So let's talk about like what actually
changes after a commission votes

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on a petition or proposal. So this next
meeting in October that we talked about

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in the in Monday's episode with ANUPA,

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there's gonna be a change after they're
gonna vote on specific petitions,

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whether they're gonna go through or
whether they're not gonna go through.

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And if they do go through, what's gonna be
changing?

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How do you actually find out what actually
changes?

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So the commission decision isn't the final
step.

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approve changes to the any MPA boundaries
or rules go through

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the state's formal rulemaking process
before they're legally in effect.

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And the updated regulations get published
once that's complete.

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So there's, a real like sometimes multi
month gap between

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the commission approved this and like this
is now an enforceable rule.

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So you know it's something that you have
to be aware of.

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Government works slow.

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They work slow for a number of different
reasons.

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some people are like, well, they just
don't work hard.

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That's not true. It takes time to make
these decisions.

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Once it goes to the approval, they have to
go through the nuances of making sure

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it fits within the law. I covered
something interesting yesterday,

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how Canada, the country, the my country,

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has ratified the high seas treaty.

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And it took a while from 2023 to now
almost 2027,

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or at the end of 2026. And it took a while
because it takes a while to ratify it.

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Because you have to put it in the laws.

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You have to make sure that every part of
the high seas treaty,

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if it's going to be accepted by Canada,

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ratified by Canada, you have to make sure
that is put forth.

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Now they had already signed on to agree to
the bill,

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then they had to ratify it. Now it's in
the laws.

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It's gonna there's gonna be line by line
items in the law to make sure that

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we accountable for that. And so the same
thing happens with the state process

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in California. There is a gap between when
it's actually approved

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and when it's enforceable because they
have to put it into law.

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That takes time. It has to go through
Congress or the Senate.

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I'm not sure the full state process is
because I'm I again I'm Canadian,

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but they have to go through that legal
process to make sure it goes through.

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That takes time. It does take time.

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And sometimes you wish it goes faster,

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but it does take time and it and it's
important that it does,

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like that make sure that they're doing
things you know,

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f by like they're actually taking it
seriously.

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Now, here's something that's interesting.

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the question, the third question is.

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How is any of this actually enforced?

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And I think this is kind of cool because
this is something a way that

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you can participate in because there is an
organization called MPA Watch.

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I covered this on either on the podcast or
on Ocean Decoded,

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I'm not sure on my YouTube channel.

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MPA Watch is a thing, statewide citizen
science network coordinated with

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the California Ocean Science Trust and
supported by the California Department

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of Fish and Wildlife. It trains ordinary
volunteers to walk designated stretches

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of coastline and record human activity in
and around the MPAs.

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Both inside the protected boundary and
outside of it,

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just for comparison. And the volunteers
use standardized data sheets,

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and the data they collect is used directly
by the California Department

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of Fish and Wildlife and other enforcement
and research partners.

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So as of the program's own recent figures,

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more than 2,000 volunteers have been
trained,

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monitored more than 115 sites,

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covering roughly over 187,000 acres of
protected and surrounding waters.

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and so like the enforcement of these
protections is not invisible and

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not purely the theoretical. We are seeing
on the ground citizen science programs

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that are monitoring people. And it's
actually shown that people are using

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the MPAs when they're allowed to use the
MPAs.

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And that's that's value. That's valuable
information that gets it's

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the social science around the MPA design
and how things are being adhered to.

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If things aren't being adhered to and
there's more enforcement need

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in certain areas.

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then that's always great. but also just to
see how people are actually using these

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Americans value their protected areas,

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their parks. It's very difficult for any
government agency to try and destroy that,

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even though they do try. but Americans
love it.

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Doesn't matter what side of the aisle you
fit on or you side on,

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it's it it's pretty tough to change
national parks and

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state parks because Americans love their
nature and they use it,

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which is great, which is amazing.

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I don't think a lot of people would think
that.

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But yeah, their parks are phenomenal and
they're well taken care of as long

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as it doesn't get touched by federal or
state governments.

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And people a lot of times don't allow
that.

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So that's really great. okay last question
that we're gonna go through what happens

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to a petition or proposal that doesn't get
adopted this cycle?

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So this can happen a lot. Like petitions
will get put forth

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and maybe at this time the commission
doesn't think that this is the right time

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to do this, or maybe they don't like the
petition,

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whether we agree with the decision or not.

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It doesn't mean it's the end of that
petition.

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Adaptive management, the same mechanisms
that we covered,

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or earlier in this week on Monday,

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the same mechanism that we discussed
earlier on Monday's episode with ANUPA

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is an explicitly recurring process written
into the Marine Life Protection Act,

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right? So

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It's not a single one-time event.

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So it comes up over and over again.

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So a proposal that doesn't move forward in
this review cycle,

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it's not permanently closed. It can be
revisited or submitted in

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the future adaptive management cycle as
new science and new monitoring data

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and new community priorities developed.

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So maybe it doesn't fit within this time
within this session,

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but it'll fit within the next adaptive
management process.

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Now, whether that's five years,

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10 years, I think it they do it every 10
years.

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That's not great if it doesn't go through.

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but you hope that it could be resubmitted.

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And this is how conservation works.

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you don't get it accepted. You go back,

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maybe add some more information,

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prepare it a little, better, not to say
that it wasn't prepared well

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in the first time. Then hopefully maybe
the commission changes.

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There's somebody on the board who doesn't
like the proposal,

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but maybe that person changes,

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that goes in, or maybe they have a change
of heart.

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And then maybe the next time the proposal
goes in.

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It's a bit of a science and a little bit
of luck and a little bit of timing

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on a lot of these things.

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And it can be tough. It can be tough to
not get your proposal

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or put petition submitted. They had quite
a number of petitions submitted this

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in this process. Not every one of them is
gonna be used.

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You just hope that the ones that should be
prioritized are gonna get prioritized.

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And that's really up to the petitioners
and to make sure that they stand

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up and they you're they're allowed to
speak and they feel safe to speak.

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That apparently did not happen last
meeting.

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Hopefully this meeting in October that
happens.

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hopefully that will go through.

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so the big thing here, you know,

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is that there are processes for MPA
design.

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It's not just science. we've talked about
it all week.

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It's not just a science thing.

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yes, data gets put in, it's very important
to identify areas using

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a science-based approach, but it's not
just the natural science data that goes
in.

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There's social science data, like how
people feel about it,

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who's proposing

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these types of MPAs. Why are they
important?

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Are they connected with other MPAs that
are in the network?

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And like in from a biological standpoint.

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So are, rockfish larvae going from one MPA
down the coast to another MPA,

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maybe that should be protected too,

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because that is a sink of this type of
larvae.

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And that's where they settle down.

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So they should be connected and both be
protected.

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Are there certain kelp areas that are
doing well?

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doing well in MPAs and not doing well
outside MPAs.

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Maybe those should become MPAs if they're
really important.

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All these different things change and
there's a process for that.

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Adaptive management plays a big role.

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The way people are allowed to speak and
the environment around that and

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how open and honest it can be is always
tough to handle.

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But it should be handled properly where
everybody feels safe to have a say.

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That's really what it comes down to,

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It doesn't seem difficult to do,

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but people's emotions get really wrapped
up in these situations because their

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livelihood's at stake. Not to make an
excuse,

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but it is something that happens.

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And it's important to make sure that
everybody,

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all groups, no matter what they look like,

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where they're from, that they get a say in
this area because they're all part

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of the same network of MPAs and it's all
going to affect them.

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And I think that's really important.

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one of the things that you can do is join
MPA Watch.

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If you're in California, you can join MPA
Watch.

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the nearest program near you. Sign up as a
volunteer.

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It's real, right? It's an existing way to
be a part of

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the enforcement and monitoring.

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And you can just see, maybe you have a
chance to go all these MPAs that

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you never really would have thought of
before,

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so to be able to monitor like if there's
access still available,

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if people are using it, what people are
doing outside the MPA,

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you can

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maybe interview people. It's a lot of fun
to be able to be a part of this

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and you feel better about yourself.

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Plus it gets you out in nature.

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I think that's really important.

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this process for MPAs, it's an open
process,

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It's a real timeline. There's data that's
involved.

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it's made public. there's a real program
to join an MPA watch and a real next
chance

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for anything

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that didn't make it through this time,

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like the in the petitions. So there's
always something that can be done.

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There's always something that you can do.

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And I think that's part of the process,

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Is to make sure that we are all available
to do this type of work and to take part,

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whether we're a scientist or not.

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You know, this is your coastline.

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This is your land. This is your state.

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If you're in California or in another
state that has a s a similar process,

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it is up to you to participate,

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You listen to this podcast, we give you
the information.

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You take that information and now it's up
to you to go and implement that

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and just show up to a meeting.

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Just observe. You don't even have to say
anything at that point.

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You can just observe, see what happens.

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If you see something that where you can
help out,

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that's great. If not, no worries.

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Join MPA Watch. Get part of that process
and then and you get to know that

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you are helping in the adaptive management
for these series of parks

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or network of MPAs for the future.

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And I think that's a really good saying
that gets you out into nature.

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I think that's kind of fun. I wish I had
something like that.

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Here in the Great Lakes. I wish Canada
would start to put MPAs in the Great
Lakes.

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I know they're not marine, but they act
like marines sometimes at their

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big lakes and they need protection.

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So hopefully that'll happen one day.

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But anyway, until then, I want to hear
from you.

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Do you think you'll, if you're in
California,

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we have a lot of listeners in California.

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Do you participate in this? Do you think
you would participate in MPA Watch?

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what do you think of the episodes this
week?

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I'd love to hear from you. If you're on
Spotify,

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leave a comment. If you are on one of our
social networks,

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feel free to DM me. LinkedIn, probably the
easiest way to get a hold

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of me because I'm on it every day with
work.

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but yeah, I would love to hear your
thoughts on that.

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it'd be great to hear. And we can't wait
for next week's episode.

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We're gonna talking about marine
pollution.

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We're starting off with an interview with
Dr.

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Judith Weiss, who is now retired but it
has had a book out

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Second edition book on marine pollution,

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which is everything you need to know about
marine pollution.

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And that's going to be the dedication for
next week.

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We're going to talk all about the
different types of marine pollution and

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how we can help reduce it. So that's going
to be on the bill for next week.

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Can't wait to talk to you next week.

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but until then, don't forget to follow.

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Don't forget to share these episodes with
somebody you think will benefit from it.

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00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:44,690
And we'll talk to you next week.

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Have a great weekend and have a great day.

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I'm your host, Andrew Lewin. You've been
watching the How to Protect

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the Ocean podcast. Talk to you soon and
happy conservation.