What You Think About Cold Water Oceans Is Probably Wrong

0:00 When we think about the ocean, we think about the tropics. We think about the warm water and snorkeling or diving and looking at beautiful sea turtles and coral reefs and all that wonderful stuff. And that's what we think. That's what we picture when we picture about going to the ocean, we go in the tropics. What if I told you there's another part of the ocean, a major part of the ocean that we often ignore, but it is just as beautiful and some can argue, if not more beautiful than the tropics. And that is cold water systems or temperate water. And today we're going to be talking to a friend of mine, a colleague of mine that I work at at Pisces oceans, Kirstie Burnett, who is a senior ocean project consultant, who's here to talk about her love for cold water oceans.

0:41 We're going to talk about some of the species that she's seen. We're going to talk some fun stuff about the mola mola, the ocean sunfish. And we're going to talk about blue sharks. And we're going to talk about a lot of different things in the ocean that she loves. And the fact that she lives just on the water in Nova Scotia. And you know, this is an episode that I've been wanting to do for a while, because oftentimes we deal with some heavy topics. We deal with some major issues in the ocean. And a lot of times we forget to celebrate what we still have. And that I think allows us to be inspired to protect more of what we need to do when we have to come up and come across these heavy issues and some of these heavy top heavier topics. So this is going to be a fun episode with Kirstie Burnett here on How to Protect the Ocean podcast, where you get all your weekday ocean use update Monday to Friday, Monday to Thursday, usually solo episodes.

1:31 Friday is an interview and we've been talking about cold water all week. And this is something that we need to start learning more about. You know, these cold water productive systems where you get North Atlantic right whales, leatherback sea turtles, the ocean sunfish called mola mola, as well as blue sharks, some of the beautiful species that are part of this part of the ocean. And I think it's something that we need to celebrate. So with that said, here is the interview with Kirstie Burnett on this episode of the How to Protect the Ocean podcast. Enjoy and I will talk to you after. Hey, Kirstie. Welcome to the How to Protect the Ocean podcast. Are you ready to talk about the ocean in cold water this time?

2:15 Always, always. I'm most familiar with the cold water ocean. I love it. I love it. Look, you know, this is kind of this is going to be a fun episode because it's almost oceans day. It'll be happy. And when this publishes, it'll be like three or four days off of oceans day, you know, and this is a time like a lot of the times like here at the how to protect the ocean pockets, I would say every day is about oceans because we talk about the ocean every day. So every day is oceans day, but it's really special. I really got to know like and respect oceans day for what it is because it's the day where people are thinking about the ocean on a regular basis, like throughout the day, because there's a lot of programs, people are doing a lot of things. And so this year, what we wanted to do is just kind of like celebrate the ocean and celebrate parts of the ocean that doesn't often get the full respect from like a wider audience than the people who live in and around these cold water environments.

3:11 And so that's what we're going to do today. And we're going to get to know you, Kristy, and we're going to get to know cold water environments and why you love them so much, why I love them so much. But maybe why some people just may not want to explore them. We kind of know why the answer probably right off the top just in the name. But you know, for those who aren't and those who maybe want to help out a little bit and be able to show us what we're what people are missing. I think it's a great, great episode to do that. So we're going to talk about science, ecology, environment. It's going to be a lot of fun. But before we get into all that stuff, Kristy, why don't you just let us know who you are and what you do? Sure. Thanks, Andrew. So my name is Kristy. I actually grew up here sitting in Nova Scotia on the east coast of Canada.

3:56 Specifically, I grew up born and raised on the eastern shore of Nova Scotia. So lucky and lucky enough on the ocean. And I have such fond memories of my parents dragging my brother and I to the beach. I guess it was probably less dragging and more like us bugging them to take us. But yeah, you know, building sandcastles, playing in the waves, collecting jellyfish and buckets to show my I guess they pretended to be enthusiastic about the jellyfish. But yeah, my parents. Yeah, so happy to be here and happy to talk about my experiences.

4:37 I love it. You know, it's interesting. I'm always surprised by this, but a lot of people who become marine biologists like myself don't necessarily grow up on the shores of eastern Canada, western Canada, the Arctic or or what have you. And and it's it's kind of interesting when somebody does and say, oh, because I always ask people like, well, what made you want to become a marine biologist? But you kind of said it right there, I assume, is being like, look, I've been, you know, I've been taking jellyfish and buckets and showing my parents and and things like that, which I think is a lot of fun. But is there a particular time in your childhood, you know, whether it be elementary school, you know, whether it be high school or even university where you really like it really kind of hits you like, no, no, like I want to be I want to be a marine scientist here.

5:26 Yeah. So. So thinking back, I think I always knew or as long as I can remember anyway, I always knew that I wanted to be a marine biologist. My parents still have Crayola drawings from me as a child where I'm just drawing these ocean ecosystems with sharks and kelp and everything like that. But the moment that I specifically remember being like, you know what, I can have a career in this and I want to have a career in this because I want to have an impact was actually watching the documentary Sharkwater by Rob Stewart. And this is just such a foundational moment in my life because he took these incredibly misunderstood animals in particular at that time when the film was coming out.

6:19 And created this incredible story about sharks and their importance and their roles in the ecosystem, the diversity of sharks in the ecosystem. And it was just it was unlike Shark Week, which is a little bit, you know, jaws focused and terminology like monster or man eater. And this was much more focused on the animal for what it is. It's part of the ecosystem. They're not monsters. They are important species to help regulate our oceans and keep our oceans healthy. So I think seeing a robbed passion during that documentary, but also seeing like I could be doing that type of work that really, really inspired me.

7:07 And then there was a particular professor that was part of that documentary for a small clip of Professor Boris Worm at Dalhousie University. Legendary. Legendary. And I in my head and I was a teenager, I was like, well, I guess I have to go to Dalhousie because I have to study under Boris Worm. So yeah, I think that's really solidified my career path. And I did end up going to Dalhousie University for my undergrad. And I luckily did get Boris as a professor for Dalhousie's first ever conservation of sharks, skates and raised biology course. So that was so cool and such a life changing moment for me.

7:52 That was in 2013. So, you know, we're over a decade ago now. I was a student in that class since then. I have been involved with the course as a teaching assistant, as a co-instructor. I'm still involved with the course. I help planning that the tagging expeditions and the other types of expeditions that the students get to go out on to see some of the blue sharks that we get off Nova Scotia here. And so it's just like it was really full circle how that all kind of came to be, to be honest. Yeah. And then I mean, I went on to do a master's degree as well. Yeah. Yeah. But I didn't stay in Nova Scotia.

8:34 So I ended up going to Germany to do my master's degree, which is a funny story in itself. I'm not sure if it's relevant to talk about now, but I absolutely. Okay, sure. Sure. So, um, let's take a step back. So I graduated from my bachelor's degree and didn't know what I wanted to do with my life. So decided I'm going to go work as a dive master in the Caribbean for a little bit and just be with the be underwater until I figure things out. And I was really fortunate. I had an aunt who lived on the island of St. Martin. So I was easily able to pack up, move there, stay with her and get my dive master certification and work as a dive master in St. Martin.

9:22 So I was there for, you know, just over a year. And during that time while on the island, they happened to have a shark conference. And at that shark conference was Boris Worm, who had been a professor of mine a couple of years back. And I thought to myself, this is so funny, but this also has to be fate. And so I took one of my days off and I got one day off a week, found somebody with a boat and knew that folks from that conference were going to be taken out to go snorkeling on some of the protected reefs in St. Martin. Right. I was like, take me out to where they're snorkeling, which they did.

10:04 They moored up the boat at the closest mooring and I jumped off that boat and swam over to their boat, popped up on the boat. It's just like, hey, Boris, I don't know if you remember me, but I was a student of yours two years ago. And so we've been friends ever since. I think he thought that was the most hilarious thing ever and very random. I don't think he'll ever forget, you know, having a former student like pop up in in like the waters of St. Martin. Like, hey, Boris, I'm not sure if you remember me. I don't know what I was thinking in my head, but I was like, I was still figuring things out for myself and knew I wasn't going to be a dive master forever and I couldn't stay in St. Martin forever.

10:49 So I was like, you know, this is fate. I have to give this a try. And so that worked in my favor when I ended up moving back to Nova Scotia. I, of course, reached out to Boris right away. And he was like, I know exactly the right person for you to start working with. And his name is Dr. Manuel DeRoy and he has a project in Cabo Verde, West Africa, and looking to tag sharks and rays there. And he's like, I don't think you in touch. He's looking for a research assistant. I'm like, this is perfect. So happy this all worked out. And I fast forward a little bit that Dr. Manuel DeRoy is now my husband.

11:32 And he's German, which is how I ended up in Germany to do my master's degree because I really, you know what? He did his PhD in Canada. Let's go to Germany for a bit and see what it's like living there so I can get my master's degree. And yeah, so I ended up doing that. We moved there in September of 2019 and I am sure everybody on the whole planet remembers what happened early in 2020. With the cold pandemic. Yeah. So my master's degree wasn't what I expected. It was a lot of working from behind a computer. I didn't get to do any of my planned field excursions or anything like that.

12:15 However, I was very fortunate to have connections in places like Cape Verde because that meant I could go, I could get samples from different shark and ray species sent to Germany to do my research. So what I ended up doing was a genomics project. I used my connections to get some samples, so little tiny fin clips from the black chin guitar fish. If you don't know what this animal is, it's you got to look it up. It's the coolest looking animal ever. It's a cross between a shark and a ray is what it looks like. Big triangular shaped nose. And they have some of the largest like fin to body size ratio.

12:56 So they're really, really highly targeted in the shark fin trade market because of that. And because they live so close to shore, their populations are just being decimated. So these giant guitar fishes are some of the most endangered, critically endangered marine animals on the planet. So what I did was take the fin clips that our partners in Cabo Verde and myself had collected. I had them sent to a sequencing lab in Germany, got that sequencing information. And for my master's degree, I assembled the first ever whole genome for the black chin guitar fish, which essentially is like taking a bunch of DNA puzzle pieces and putting it together in a logical order.

13:44 So now nobody else has to do that ever again. They now have the blueprint for the black chin guitar fish. And they can use that for monitoring things and checking things like population health of different populations, individual populations. People are starting to age species using their genomes, which is very interesting. Oh, cool. So just having that is a very important baseline tool for conservation. So that's what I did for my master's. That's very cool. It didn't end up falling in love with Germany. I'm going to be honest, but I think that largely the pandemic is to blame. So we ended up coming back.

14:25 Of course, can't get out can't meet people. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you came back to Nova Scotia where where you are now. We work together, which is which is a lot of fun. So we've been like since since April, which is you've been here. I think you've been at Pisces for a year. Just yeah. Yeah, just over a year now. I've been working as an ocean project consultant. And so the academia world, it's it's great. It's important, but Pisces oceans really drew me in. Yeah, because it was taking, you know, research that is being done by academics or by industry, by NGOs and really helping to communicate it in a way that resonates with funders, with policymakers, like we can be the partners helping to manage this important work while the researchers are, you know, behind the screens doing data analyses, doing the data collection out in the field.

15:26 It really felt like I could have more of an impact helping others drive their research forward than doing my own research. So I was so excited to be able to join Pisces oceans. And I've just loved my time here so far. And I think if I'm not mistaken, Andrew, you feel the exact same way. 100 percent, 100 percent to be able to help. The one thing that I love about, you know, for me, I'm on the communication side where we both kind of overlap in a lot of the areas that we that we work on. But as we've discussed in the past, you know, it's nice to be able to scale that effort where it's not just you just doing one project that will help something maybe who knows may forge some legislation through or help some policy.

16:14 But we're also working on like a number of different projects, you know, in the nonprofit world, in the for profit world, indigenous world and academic world. And we're being able to have a I feel like a significant positive impact on each one of those projects to move that forward. So at the end of the day, we can be like, oh, hey, like we've done all this great stuff, which is which is a lot of fun, which, you know, for us, you know, especially I've been in this this game for quite some time for for over 25 years. And it's nice to be able to see things progress and to be a part of that on a variety of different different ways, which is which is a lot of fun. But I want to go back. I feel like there's this like theme for you in terms of not only just looking at like the science or the policy, the thing that really caught my ear was when you mentioned shark water, you know, and you're looking at at shark water and you're saying, look, and it's true.

17:10 Like when I think of shark water, I think of an advocacy film, right? It's it ends up being a documentary that celebrates sharks and we'll come to that in a second. But also at the end, really, I feel like open the eyes to a lot more people on the shark fin trade and how prevalent it was throughout the world, not just in Costa Rica, where a lot of this was shot and where they discovered the roofs of shark fins, but also like where it goes and all that kind of stuff. And it's it's it was kind of it was before blackfish, but it kind of did what blackfish did for the captive marine animals industry, which is kind of, you know, took the blinders off a lot of people and really opened it up, which is which was kind of cool.

17:52 But when you mentioned the film, it wasn't just about shark fins actually never mentioned anything about shark fins is more about what the movie started out to be was a movie to celebrate sharks and the diversity of species that are out there. Right. Because we think, you know, a lot of times when I if I ask anybody, name me a shark, it's either a white shark, a tiger shark, a bull shark, hammerhead shark, maybe thresher shark, you know, like the kind of hitting those iconic species, which are fascinating in their own right. But you never hear of a guitar fish, a soft, you know, sawtooth, you know, you never hear of all those different types of sharks as as a buddy of mine and my co-host on Beyond Jaws, Dave Ebert calls the the the rays, the shark rays like like he calls either shark rays or a flat shark, you know, just to kind of the marketing, you know, to get people in or, you know, or even like chimeras.

18:46 You know, a lot of people don't know that chimeras are part of the shark family or even skates and rays are part of the Lassmo Branks. And so I think it's really interesting hearing that from your perspective of like this movie was about the beauty of sharks. And if I asked anybody else about shark water, it's a movie about shark fins. And I think that goes to say why, why you got into this and sort of your history of like growing up around the ocean and enjoying species, enjoying sharks, but also enjoying like jellyfish and the fish and the invertebrates. I'm sure you saw in the tide pools and in your snorkeling and diving experience. What is it about just for that marine environment that you that you love so much?

19:27 Because I know you are worth all talk about in a second. You love wildlife in and around your house that you've seen. Take some amazing photographs. But what is it about like ocean species in particular that that really kind of get peak your interest? Yeah, so my husband and I talk about this all the time because truly I love all animals. I love land animals as well. But land animals feel just so accessible. And there's just something like the little bit of mystery about animals living under the water. They're just not as accessible. And I think as a kid, that was really fascinating to me. And like I have fond memories of my grandmother reading bedtime stories to my brother and I.

20:11 And the story that I always asked her to read was actually more of a mini textbook of these really kind of neat, different, unusual type ocean creatures. Right. My poor grandmother. And I just like I couldn't believe that animals like that existed out there. Like I think I was always asking her about the lion's mane jellyfish and the blue bottle jellyfish and like, how long do their tentacles get? Oh, my goodness. And yeah, I just just something about that mystery is really what drew me in. And then being in Nova Scotia and living here, like you said, I could explore tide pools.

20:53 So so one of the things that always caught my eye were these bright blue polychaete worms that you could find in the tidal pools here. And I don't know much about them, but I do know that they're very beautiful and I do know that pollution seems to have affected them. I don't see them as much around anymore, to be honest. What else have I seen? The seagrasses here, like the eelgrass here in Nova Scotia. The eelgrass is a cold water species and I've really I remember growing up and seeing eelgrass in the different inlets and harbors here where I grew up. And you just don't see as much of it here anymore. But what you do see is a lot of coastal erosion here now.

21:40 And it's just I think it's interesting having grown up and being obsessed with the ocean because it's all these things that I'm not sure the average person would notice. So just being able to acknowledge these types of ecosystems and being a part and feeling like I'm a part of these ecosystems and that I can have a voice for them has just always I don't know. That's drawn me in and it's what keeps me interested in why I love living in the community I live in and still on an inlet and still in the ocean. And yeah, that's awesome. Now, you mentioned at one point you went down to St. Martain to pursue being a dive master and you did that and you dove.

22:27 I would assume like every weekday or every time you worked, you're pretty much in the water being able to see again, explore and be able to understand animals. What type of perspective did you get coming from a cold water temperate environment to a warm tropical environment and diving? I assumed you dove in in in the in Nova Scotia as well when you were learning before you became a dive master. Yes. What perspective did that give you, you know, in terms of just experiences diving and because a lot of people would rather go down to the tropics to dive. They'll do make these elaborate trips to go diving. But then, you know, there's still some beautiful things to see in the cold water.

23:07 So like what what kind of perspective that give you going down to the tropics to dive? Yeah, so I think perspectives go both ways. So I learned to dive here in Nova Scotia. So I learned to dive in cold water and having done both diving in cold water and warm water, I can definitely say cold water diving is a whole other beast. And mad respect to people who do that often. And I think doing that made diving in St. Martin feel easy to me. I feel like in St. Martin, I thought I was seeing a lot more than I would see in Nova Scotia.

23:52 But that's not true. So the practices and the techniques I learned while doing my dive master and as I took people out on tours to see the reefs was that if you really stay still underwater, and just look at an area on a coral reef or in a kelp or on a rock bed, you will see more than if you're swimming fast and trying to see it all. So just taking that experience from St. Martin and actually bringing it back here to Nova Scotia and really just being calm underwater and staying still and feeling like I am a part of the environment and just enjoying my immediate surroundings.

24:34 You see so much more than I think people can expect. Like we get these really cool nudibranchs here in Nova Scotia. Also very colorful types of underwater sea slugs. They're very, very tiny centimeters big. So you really have to be still and look for them and just enjoy what you're seeing. And if you're doing a night dive, you can see different types of polychaete worms, for example, the kind of bioluminous as they're swimming by you, which is really, really neat. Oh, that's cool. Yeah. And we have so much fish that just hide and bury themselves in the sand. Not that St. Martin doesn't, but I feel like you've got a lot of that right here in Nova Scotia, a lot of hiding creatures.

25:16 And so I think it really just taught me to slow down and just really appreciate everything that was around me. St. Martin was easy because you could still see a lot without doing that. But if you learn to do that, you can really learn to appreciate in particular cold water diving. Yeah, because I mean, I feel like cold water diving is a quicker dive, you know, just because you probably go through a little bit more air, you're breathing a little faster because of the cold. It's just the body's physiology reacting to the cold water. When you're in the tropics, it would probably be a little bit of a longer dive. I think a lot of the myths, the myth is that you would probably see more in the tropics or more cool things in the tropics.

25:57 But you have already talked about a number of different things. Now, I have to admit, I'm a diver. I haven't gone diving in a while, but I'm a diver. I am terrified of night dives anywhere, whether it be in the ocean or whether it be in the Great Lakes. There's something about it. I don't I don't feel that I would panic. I think if I if I went down, I'd be back up in about 15 minutes because I'd be out of air. But but like you've mentioned a lot of cool, cool things, cool animals that you see, especially in the in the worm. You know, like you see some nematodes, you see some polychaete worms, which is kind of cool. And then you see the bioluminescence at night, which is which is really amazing. What's your favorite animal that you've seen in in in like off the coast of Nova Scotia in this cold water environment?

26:42 Yeah, so I haven't seen these animals diving here because admittedly, I do less diving now that I've been spoiled with warm water or something. I've been here a little bit and then I used to. But we still do go out on a boat. I still paddle quite often. So the coolest animal that I've ever seen here, oh, my gosh, I've been so lucky. I've seen so many and definitely the sharks and the sharks. How special place in my heart because this is the shark that I was introduced to when I was a student at Dalhousie doing my undergrad. And it's if you've never worked with a shark before or if you're scared of sharks and you've never seen a shark before, this is really the perfect shark for you to encounter in the wild.

27:32 They are kind of dopey kind of puppy dog like they are typically not beat up like you'd see with the with a white shark that has a bunch of scarring over its face. So they don't look aggressive per se. It's still a shark. It's still a wild animal and they still should be respected as such. But everybody who I've taken out to see a blue shark in the wild who has been apprehensive about sharks has come back from that. Without apprehension anymore. They they love sharks after meeting a blue shark. So I think that holds a special place in my heart because it it teaches people to appreciate sharks in a way that like a great white shark or a tiger shark couldn't just because of kind of the stigma that they have around them.

28:25 Of course, I really love a poor shark. I get to see them as well. They're like tiny little. I mean, they grow big, but the ones that I'm seeing here off Nova Scotia are often quite small, tiny little footballs. They are so. I never thought of a poor being like a football, but that makes I'm a big football fan. Yeah, I know them a little bit more. You got your fan of football and blow poor people. Let me ask you, you mentioned like when you when you take people out, how are you like you are you taking them on a paddle board? Are you taking them on a boat? Like how are you taking people out like friends? I assume and and colleagues and stuff like how are you seeing?

29:06 Good question. Good question. So I has not been friends yet, but that is to come. Students, but you know, some of the students that I've been fortunate enough to work with at Dalhousie either through my role as a teaching assistant or as a co instructor. Some of them have seen sharks before, but many of them have never even stepped foot on a boat before, let alone seen a shark. True. So yeah, they're taking the course because they're interested in sharks, but some of them do still have that apprehension. So it's really the students and getting to show that to the students and allow that to be a part of their learning journey.

29:48 That really resonates with me. Now, saying that my husband and I just bought a boat. Yes. So we are looking forward to going out and being able to see sharks, just the two of us or bring out friends and family. We know where they are off of Nova Scotia. We know how to find them. So that'll be it'll be a nice experience. And and to be honest, when we're seeing the sharks through Dalhousie shark class, there's always an aspect to it that is a little bit stressful because we are tagging the animals. So we are taking them out of the water. Yeah, I can go out on my own boat and just see them. I don't have to take them out of the water. I can leave them in the water.

30:28 They can do their own thing. I can just enjoy them in their natural environment. And so I'm really looking forward to that and being able to show friends and family that. Yeah. So I think this is interesting. You know, I approached this episode initially as like, because of I know your your history in scuba diving, which is amazing. And I am like, oh, yeah, well, if you scuba dive, you'll probably see like so many cool things. You're talking about taking people on a boat. Sometimes students, you know, where you're doing work with them and showing them how to do so so they can build on their skills and their experience and on their career. But when you're saying, hey, when you and menu go out on the on your own boat, which congratulations, by the way, you're you want to see them in their natural environment.

31:10 So I guess the question is, is like what type of animals if you're on the surface and you're and you're just, you know, kind of cruising along. Obviously, you're probably not going to see like a ton, even when you're in tropics, like by cruising along. But what could people expect to see on a on a fairly regular basis when you do see animals? What could you what could they expect to see or what do you expect to see? Yeah. Without a question, catching a tag. Yeah, no, this is great because this is a way that everybody can experience ocean life without having to. To learn how to dive because I realized that is not for everybody.

31:53 Of course, if you go out here off of Nova Scotia and you don't even need to go very far. So, you know, you could be right along the coastline. You can see gray seals. I see them right from my house almost weekly, which is very cool. You can see Harbor porebice. You know, they're going into all the inlets, the harbor, Halifax Harbor. You can see them all the time. And if you go out a little bit further offshore and I'm not talking very far, you can still see land where I'm talking. We've seen different animals like ocean sunfish kind of setting themselves up the surface of the water.

32:33 Otherwise known as a mola mola. And they are the best looking fish that you would ever imagine seeing. Again, if you're listening to this and you have no idea what an ocean sunfish is, look it up. They have essentially on the top and bottom of their body and they do not look like they should be able to move, but they can. And that is just incredible. Other things that we've seen before you go on. Sorry, just before you go on just to just to interrupt, I have to say this because like one of my most memorable moments work because I did my master's at Acadia.

33:15 And Nova Scotia and I remember we did a project, you know, I was working as a technician for my profit. We were going around all the inlets and stuff and we were just at the outskirts of an estuary. So kind of like out in the ocean. And I remember seeing this like weirdest thing in the ocean. It was like it looked like something was dead at the surface of the ocean. Right. And a lot of people I think usually usually see that. So we kind of say, let's just go and see if we can get a closer look. And and as you get closer, you see this this this like thing that looks flat, but it's really vertical and then it kind of shifts to flat and then vertical. And so and that's what it does. That's why it's known as the sunfish is because of bays in the sun at the at the surface and things like that.

33:57 And it goes out. But it is the weirdest looking fish ever. And it is so cool to see a fish like this where you're just like, I did not expect to see this today to be able to see it. So, sorry, I just wanted to mention that little story because it is one of the favorite things. So you can see that in the Roshanohiscocha. So totally cool animal to see. Other animals that you can see are leatherback turtles. So the largest turtle species that we have. Yeah. They come in in the summer to feed on our jellyfish. And we see and I feel like more and more in recent years, I've been seeing a lot of different whales, which is incredible.

34:37 So yeah, humpback whales. We're seeing fin whales, which is the second largest whale. Now, in saying that we do get blue whales here off of Nova Scotia. And I've been trying to manifest a blue whale in my life for years now because I think that would be incredible. But yeah, we get we get a lot of different whale species. I've seen say whales before as well. Last year was my first time seeing pilot whales. So that was really interesting. Yeah, different dolphin species. Different bird species.

35:18 So I think we get a lot of bird people here in Nova Scotia. So if you go offshore at all, you are seeing completely different bird wildlife than you're seeing here onshore. It's absolutely incredible. One of my favorite are storm petrels. You rarely will see them onshore. And there are these tiny little black petrels, tiny little blackbirds. And they'll just like whip in and around your boat. And they are beautiful and fast and fast. I have no idea what they're doing out there. I have no idea where they're going. My background is not in ornithology, but they're very cool to see. Yeah, I remember the first time I saw those, I thought they were bats.

35:59 I really did. I thought they were bad. I'm like, how does the basket all the way out here? I'm like, I don't understand. Yeah, because they're quite dark and they they went around quite fast. Yeah. So just tons of wildlife that you can see from the surface, to be honest. And then, like I said, you can see sharks. There are more white shark sightings each year, it seems. And people have seen basking sharks here in Nova Scotia from the surface. They come to the surface to feed on plankton. And yeah, we do get different types of mobulids. So those are larger ray species. I haven't seen them myself, but they are here off Nova Scotia.

36:40 I think it's just it's something new every time you go out and it makes it exciting. I think that's I think it's pretty cool because I don't think a lot of people will think about that on a break. I like when they think about the coastline, you know, we think in the wet on the west coast off the coast of like Vancouver and in the Charlotte islands and everything. You you think of of orca as you think of gray whales and humpbacks because we people show them quite quite often. I feel as though with with the the presence of a man by the name of Dr. Neil Hamish. Like he has really up the the the the public awareness of of great whites that are coming to Nova Scotia and that they they are here and that they keep seeing them come in more north.

37:32 And it's it's probably a function of a number of different things. Climate change, including climate change and and just how well they're doing on the east coast and moving forward, I assume, for for better, better competition or less competition. So that I think it's kind of cool to see that. But, you know, do you find that people you grew up with, you know, your marine biologists, you know, you not only do you go up around the shore, you know, the coastline, but you also like live and breathe it on a daily basis. Our work is all around ocean stuff, whether we're not in it. We may not be in it every day, but we're talking about ocean. So you're more aware of the stuff that goes on. Do you find like your average person who lives in Nova Scotia, you know, is aware of the different species that around do they go out? Do they have the opportunity to go out on a boat or have friends that go out on a boat, whether they're part of a fishing community or something else where they have access to go out?

38:26 Do you find there there as much invested in the coastline as say someone like you and I that are marine scientists? Yeah, so I think that's an interesting question. So, for example, my family, there are in my immediate family, there are no fishers, there are no marine biologists, there's nobody else working in the ocean sector, per se. Sometimes I come back after being on the ocean with stories of things that I seen out there. And I'm like, I had no idea you could see that off of here. Yeah, in saying that I do live in a fishing community. And I think fishers know more than they talk about. Because every time that I've had discussions with the local fishers, they're like, of course you have that here. I see that all the time.

39:14 And I'm like, this is great. This would be great research. It would be so these animals. And I think it's just a different lifestyle. You know, they're going out and they're targeting, you know, their lobsters or anything. And they're talking targeting their cod, you know, they're not thinking about the marine life in the same way that I'm thinking about it. So yes, they're seeing it. They know it's out there. But it's not registering to them. How how special and unique that experience it is. I'm the same way that it is for somebody like me who grew up, like obsessed with animals and biodiversity. Not saying that they don't think it's important.

39:58 Every fisher that I talked to acknowledges the importance of a biodiverse ecosystem and because that helps maintain healthy fish populations. It's just that's the lens they're seeing it in. So I think, you know, to answer your question, yes and no. There are community members here who are very aware of what's out there. But I think a lot of people are not. And that a lot of cool opportunity to try and teach people and show people. What is out there? Yeah, for sure. And like I'm going out to Halifax for a conference. We're going to we have some work to do at the H2O conference in Halifax. June, I believe it's June 8th, June 9th and June 10th, which is going to be a lot of fun. But what can people do?

40:47 I'm looking forward to going explore. I'm looking forward to I live there, you know, like 20 years ago. I'm looking forward to going to see how things have changed. But also, like, I can't wait to go back to that waterfront and walk it out there. And just enjoy the smell of the ocean and being able to see trying to be able to spot any kind of animal I can see for sure. Maybe even go out on a little bit of a harbor cruise. I don't know. We'll see. But like for the people who are visiting Nova Scotia or even for Nova Scotians themselves who haven't connected, haven't had a chance to connect or I mean, like a lot of tourists go to the East Coast, especially during the June, July, these types of months, the summer, spring and summer. What is there to do to really dive deep into, you know, what we're looking at, like, or what is available in terms of productivity animals, all that kind of stuff in the ocean? How can they really connect? What's there to do in in whether be Halifax, Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, wherever?

41:46 Yeah, that's a great question. So I guess right before the H2O conference in Halifax itself, actually, it's a great question. So June 7th on Halifax waterfront and at various other stops along that route. Basically, it's a bunch of businesses, organizations, NGOs, academia, dive shops, you know, Pisces oceans is even getting involved with a cold water connector event. So check that out. Yeah, I think really that is the day if you want to learn more about the oceans here in Nova Scotia, particularly to come on down to the Halifax waterfront or the different stops along the Oceans Day route and just learn from the different people doing different things like, for example, last year, I believe there was the Marine Animal Response Society was there and they're talking about the work that they do.

42:44 Helping to rescue stranded whales or injured seals and things like that. Or you could talk to the different dive shops about the stuff that they're seeing underwater, which would be like the event we're teaming up with the dive shop to talk about cold water and the different wildlife and animals you can see there. So I think really that's the place to go, you know, even government goes in on that event. So fisheries and oceans Canada or DFO has been involved in that event. They have like a large map that they lay out on the floor sometimes and then it shows the different areas where there are marine protected areas or where they're planning to put in marine protected areas.

43:27 So that's a really, really great day to showcase all the different work that is happening around Nova Scotia. Otherwise, a lot of our beaches are provincial parks. So you know, just get out and go to a beach and learn by being there, you know, take a moment at the ocean. Don't rush your stay. Just like really be in the moment. Be with the beach, be with the water. And I think you'd be surprised what you can see or find on the beach or see from the beach. So 100% 100% I I was up at a conference in Newfoundland back in 2014. We went up and we were in St. John's. We decided, Hey, you know what the thing to do is let's walk up signal Hill. It says it's a hill. It's a big walk. So be careful when you walk up there. Be ready to big walk. When we got to the top, you know, you see on the other side of it as you get to the top, you just see ocean as far as you as far as your eye can see.

44:27 And it's certain times the year we were there in July, certain times the year you get to see the humpbacks frolicking in the water and jumping and stuff. And I got to see that just by being there. Now, that's not a guarantee every time you're going to see wildlife like that. But, you know, spend some time just sit and enjoy, you know, a lot of the times we don't realize how soothing it is to be able to stare at that big blue ocean and just enjoy the calmness and like start to observe how many seabirds you can see, you know, the, you know, all the different like the waves, the coastline, the wind. It's just, it's unbelievable. Unbelievably relaxing. It's great for your mental health. Because I think we all have to worry about our mental health these days with all the world happening. But there's nothing better than on Oceans Day, which I think Oceans Day is officially on the 8th to go out, spend some time along the coastline. If you're in the Halifax Dartmouth area, please stop by where we're going to be.

45:23 We all put some more information in the outro, an intro so that you can check us out if you're in that area. We'd love to say hi. If you've been a long time listener to the How to Protect the Ocean podcast, please come say hi. I'd love to have a chat with you on that. And you get to see some really cool dive shop as well as some, we got some aquariums, I think, that we're planning on bringing by. Yeah, there's going to be some touch tanks and I'm bringing in my personal shark collection, I'm calling it. So I will teeth, jaws, skate eggs. So if you don't know what a state is, it is a cousin of the sharks and rays. We have a lot of them here. We actually have 19 different ray and skate species here in Nova Scotia. So I will be chatting about those. I even have a baby shark, not alive, but you can come see a real new shark.

46:12 That is so cool. I can't wait to take a look at it. But Chrissy, I want to thank you so much. I think this is your first podcast. It is my first podcast. Thank you for having me. That is amazing. And it won't be your last. We'll have you do some more stuff later on if you're willing to come back and talk more about not only just, you know, your enjoyment of species, but we'll get into the science that you've done in the next in another episode. And we'd love to have you back on. But thank you so much for joining us today. It was a lot of fun. Thank you for having me. Thank you, Kirsty, for joining us on today's episode of the how to protect the ocean podcast was great having her on and I'm looking forward to having her back on to talk more about the wonderful ocean species.

46:52 She is a shark biologist, and we're gonna be talking more with her about psychology in the coming episodes, probably later on, but because I always like to mix it up a little bit with people. But she's just a wealth of knowledge and so much fun to be able to talk to you. And if you want to talk to Kirsty and myself, as well as some of the other members of Pisces oceans, Natalie and Melissa from our co CEOs, we are hosting an ocean day event that's Sunday, June 7th in house. That's Sunday, June 7th in Halifax off the Bedford Highway in Bedford, Nova Scotia. It's at 1440 Bedford Highway. It's actually at a dive shop. We're going to be hanging out in the parking lot.

47:33 We're going to have some some things to touch and feel in terms of some fossilized teeth, shark teeth and maybe some jaws and we'll see a lot of different things. But we're there to talk if you ever want to chat if you're in the Halifax, greater Halifax region or in Nova Scotia and you want a fun morning of hanging out with and talking oceans. You can do that from 9am to 11am Halifax time. That's Atlantic time. That's Sunday, June 7th, 1440 Bedford Highway Bedford Nova Scotia would love to chat with you if you're a fan of the podcast or you're a fan of just oceans in general and you want to come out and hang out with us for a couple of hours. Please let us know. We'd be happy to do so. So that's it for today's episode. I want to thank Kirsty and I want to thank you for listening to this episode. We got more Oceans Week fun stuff coming from the ocean. I'm going to do some off the cuff like five episodes just for fun and see what we can come up with in terms of topics. I'm looking forward to doing that and I want to thank you so much for being a fan of the how to protect the ocean podcast because the fact that you guys listen to this episode and that you listen to the all the episodes or as many episodes as you can and get yourself interested in the oceans and you're looking at resources. I love the fact that you come each and every day or whenever you can to come back and listen to these episodes. I can't it's just fun to be able to have that and be able to talk to you and for if you want to get a hold of me, you can hit me up in my socials in the show notes and of course I'll put the

49:04 information to our event for oceans. Well, the day before Ocean's Day June 7th to talk about more about cold water, especially around Halifax. So I want to hear your stories and what your favorite species is in and around the Nova Scotia area in the ocean up in Eastern Canada. So thank you again for joining us on today's episode. Of the how to protect the ocean podcast. I'm your host, Angelo and have a great day. We'll talk to you next time and happy conservation.